Ouddict Forum Changes

[Joe King]

Those that replied and use the forum are the minority and seem to have a vested interest in oud. It is what it is. It's just a scent. It's never gonna be a huge phenomenonal super active forum. It's not something which will be so populated and active. At best you active members who post reviews and jump at the chance to post any small thing are a small cult of the extreme from among the extreme. Majority of ppl treat oud as it is: a scent they wipe on their body.

Glad to be in the cult then!

I am very excited, I have always wondered what it would be like to be in a cult and not just any cult but an extreme extreme cult.
We need a cult leader then I would like to nominate brother Nooob

 

[Grega]

I am very excited, I have always wondered what it would be like to be in a cult and not just any cult but an extreme extreme cult.
We need a cult leader then I would like to nominate brother Nooob

Soon to be Grand Master Noob!
No need for secret signals. We know our fraters and sorores by their smell

God I feel extreme now.

 

[F4R1d0uX]

God I feel extreme now

 

[F4R1d0uX]

I am very excited, I have always wondered what it would be like to be in a cult and not just any cult but an extreme extreme cult.
We need a cult leader then I would like to nominate brother Nooob

Once I used to be in an association in which I invested lot of time.

When I saw people talking all the time about how the owner is wonderful more than the meaning of the association, I just ran away with 0 notice .

I think either someone is made for a cult or not, from your posts, here and elsewhere, I can guess you're not made for it

 

[Dan]

I'm pretty new to Ouddict and I went through this whole thread... what I like about it is that what started of with challenges of managing marketplace, forum etc... delved into a member Rai Munir etc ... and now it's at a level where there is so much love being thrown by LMK, JK, Hashimi at each other Hahahah love it

My experience so far has been great with Ouddict not yet bought anything from the marketplace since shipping is an issue to India and most of the marketplace buzz comes from the US ... I only use a few forums to share my experience with an Oud or to read ones experience.


Oud-Fest should go to Dubai next midway for everyone to try and get there atleast for a day or two. Plus arabs may make it far more interesting on the pockets for the vendors.


We should have GuruOud (education section) for a newbie like me by vendors itll be great. Each Vendor should pick up topic and post educational stuff.


That's just my 2 cents




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[Ouddict]

Those that replied and use the forum are the minority and seem to have a vested interest in oud. It is what it is. It's just a scent. It's never gonna be a huge phenomenonal super active forum. It's not something which will be so populated and active. At best you active members who post reviews and jump at the chance to post any small thing are a small cult of the extreme from among the extreme. Majority of ppl treat oud as it is: a scent they wipe on their body.

It’s sad that you have the time to appear and write so many posts about why there shouldn’t be posts on the forum. Your time on here would be much better spent on the other threads and you might even learn something.

Of course I do accept your point that not everyone wants to post reams and that’s fine... but they then have to understand that not being an active part of a community might lead to restrictions for them on a marketplace if this is the only area where they seem to be active, as the forum management may deem it one way to encourage participation and that’s their prerogative to do so. This is a community and not eBay and being able to post on the marketplace so freely is a privilege and not a right. eBay exists for those who just want to be able to sell Ouds and not participate in any other way.

By the way, the marketplace was focused on simply because it was the area which was most active in relation to the other areas and if for example vendor spaces were a lot more active compared to the rest of the thread boards we may have considered action to rebalance that as well. The principle here is that we want the community to be alive and functional in other important areas too.

Sometimes I honestly wonder if the forum ethos of being so open and welcoming to all is counterproductive as I sense an entitlement complex when talking to some.

 

[Ouddict]

I'm pretty new to Ouddict and I went through this whole thread... what I like about it is that what started of with challenges of managing marketplace, forum etc... delved into a member Rai Munir etc ... and now it's at a level where there is so much love being thrown by LMK, JK, Hashimi at each other Hahahah love it

My experience so far has been great with Ouddict not yet bought anything from the marketplace since shipping is an issue to India and most of the marketplace buzz comes from the US ... I only use a few forums to share my experience with an Oud or to read ones experience.


Oud-Fest should go to Dubai next midway for everyone to try and get there atleast for a day or two. Plus arabs may make it far more interesting on the pockets for the vendors.


We should have GuruOud (education section) for a newbie like me by vendors itll be great. Each Vendor should pick up topic and post educational stuff.


That's just my 2 cents




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Hmmmm I like the suggestion about an Ouducation section. We will definitely consider it.

 

[Bilalw]

I just feel like u made a problem out of nothing and are forcing a solution to it. Leave it alone. If ppl only wanna sell the oud then so be it. At least they are here and at least ppl benefit from obtaining the oils, and clearly they themselves are also buying oils. Forcing ppl to comment around the forum to have access to the marketplace is odd. As for taking the time to post here, I felt I can chip in and be a worthwhile 2 cents, especially considering the echo chamber is quite powerful around here , let along the clique and elite sorta vibes with the undertone of which particular sect dominates conversation generally speaking ... Obviously more ppl are buying and interested in that aspect of oud than they are about talking about it or typing it out. Perhaps it's difficult to put into words for some or they have other reasons not to participate. Why penalize them, I don't think any good will come from it. Perhaps u will just force ppl to post nonsense to gain access, would that be what u want from the forum? How will u judge the genuine contributers then or would it matter? This is such a small group of devotees , I don't see a reason to fracture it any more. Instead promote conversation by reward structure perhaps, or make it a more inclusive environment rather than elitist. Or just come out with it and block the marketplace for non paying members. I'm sure that will accomplish the goal also.

 

[zahir]

This is such a small group of devotees , I don't see a reason to fracture it any more. Instead promote conversation by reward structure perhaps, or make it a more inclusive environment rather than elitist. Or just come out with it and block the marketplace for non paying members. I'm sure that will accomplish the goal also.

Hmm...

 

[powdernose]

Obviously more ppl are buying and interested in that aspect of oud than they are about talking about it or typing it out.

That is true.
Most people are content to buy, sell and wear with little comment.

Forcing ppl to comment around the forum to have access to the marketplace is odd.

It is neither odd, nor a penalty.
Most forums have limitations and restrictions when it comes to their marketplaces.
You'll find some even have restrictions that extend to viewing rights to their marketplace as well, not only for participation.

It is probably some kind of a miracle that a marketplace with zero restrictions has run so smoothly thus far.

Instead promote conversation by reward structure perhaps, or make it a more inclusive environment rather than elitist.

In what way do you feel this is an exclusive environment?
I think you'll find you can contribute to any aspect of this forum.
If you have any suggestions or initiatives, by all means bring them forward.

 

[Grega]

I just feel like u made a problem out of nothing and are forcing a solution to it. Leave it alone. If ppl only wanna sell the oud then so be it. At least they are here and at least ppl benefit from obtaining the oils, and clearly they themselves are also buying oils. Forcing ppl to comment around the forum to have access to the marketplace is odd. As for taking the time to post here, I felt I can chip in and be a worthwhile 2 cents, especially considering the echo chamber is quite powerful around here , let along the clique and elite sorta vibes with the undertone of which particular sect dominates conversation generally speaking ... Obviously more ppl are buying and interested in that aspect of oud than they are about talking about it or typing it out. Perhaps it's difficult to put into words for some or they have other reasons not to participate. Why penalize them, I don't think any good will come from it. Perhaps u will just force ppl to post nonsense to gain access, would that be what u want from the forum? How will u judge the genuine contributers then or would it matter? This is such a small group of devotees , I don't see a reason to fracture it any more. Instead promote conversation by reward structure perhaps, or make it a more inclusive environment rather than elitist. Or just come out with it and block the marketplace for non paying members. I'm sure that will accomplish the goal also.

Do you really think that you are making a succesful plea for the marketplace to remain unrestricted by insulting all the members that post here regularly. The only elitism I have noticed on this forum is the one in your posts.

 

[Al Shareef Oudh]

Once I used to be in an association in which I invested lot of time.

When I saw people talking all the time about how the owner is wonderful more than the meaning of the association, I just ran away with 0 notice .

I think either someone is made for a cult or not, from your posts, here and elsewhere, I can guess you're not made for it

and the 'guy with the hair's was no longer...make sense now

 

[F4R1d0uX]

and the 'guy with the hair's was no longer...make sense now [emoji23][emoji23]

Ahahaha yeh I cut my hair !

Envoyé de mon MI 8 en utilisant Tapatalk

 

[Bilalw]

Do you really think that you are making a succesful plea for the marketplace to remain unrestricted by insulting all the members that post here regularly. The only elitism I have noticed on this forum is the one in your posts.

If u think that's an insult then I'm sorry you feel that way.

As for suggestions to make it more inclusive or whatever, I'm not sure. It's just a feeling I get and thought to throw it out there. Sometimes ppl on the inside cannot understand from the outsides perspective. Take it as you may or don't. As with most postings, it's my subjective opinion not much more. The reactions do speak volumes tho don't they

 

[Grega]

If u think that's an insult then I'm sorry you feel that way.

As for suggestions to make it more inclusive or whatever, I'm not sure. It's just a feeling I get and thought to throw it out there. Sometimes ppl on the inside cannot understand from the outsides perspective. Take it as you may or don't. As with most postings, it's my subjective opinion not much more. The reactions do speak volumes tho don't they

Dear Bilalw, if you don't find your posts insulting then I don't know what an actual insult would be for you. The reactions are mild, trying to change the tone of your terribly insulting remarks with some humor, but as I see you are doing nothing but fishing for a forum duel I will ignore you.

Last word of advice, stop projecting your own attitude of elitism on other forum members.

 

[RisingPhoenix]

Maybe here is another way to look at this, since I feel like we are veering off into some unnecessary tension...

Ouddict is a community platform that is funded by the vendors. I don't know if folks really realize this - but this is a FREE SPACE we have created for everyone. It's a free space for members to interact, unload unused materials, learn, share, etc.

eBay, on the other hand - charges something like 20% to sell stuff. Ouddict charges nothing to its members. There's no advertising (not referring to Vendor advertising - I mean like adverts as seen on every other web platform, which is how they both cover their costs and generate revenue). Ouddict isn't a business in the way that Basenotes, Fragrantica, eBay, etc are businesses. We set it up this way so that you, the user, are not inundated with a gazillion ads like every other "community" space has become.

What many of us have noticed is that Ouddict is turning into a free eBay for some folks. It's supposed to be a Community - rather than a selling platform for its members.

All that is being asked is that folks start contributing more to the discussions and Community aspect. If they are just here to sell...there may be some limits or concessions that are imposed on non-contributing members that are only selling.

We had a lot of discussion at the London Fest about how misconstruing the written word can be at times - and there tends to be more drama than as is necessary. Remember - this forum is all about handshakes and high fives, laughs and learning. We are an inquisitive bunch and we are just asking everyone to be full participants if they are going to sell. There are TONS of lurkers on Ouddict (read - thousands and thousands of folks that read but don't participate). We are just asking for more folks to take a leap and start participating. It's more fun having a more robust community.

We just want to see that folks are involved - not just hawking their wares.

 

[Woodland Note]

Those that replied and use the forum are the minority and seem to have a vested interest in oud. It is what it is. It's just a scent. It's never gonna be a huge phenomenonal super active forum. It's not something which will be so populated and active. At best you active members who post reviews and jump at the chance to post any small thing are a small cult of the extreme from among the extreme. Majority of ppl treat oud as it is: a scent they wipe on their body.

Your words do no justice to oud. But it’s fine, we are all different, and we have different levels of appreciation of things.
There is lots beauty in nature, stunning poetry of colors, scents, sounds... Many pass by and do not pay attention, sometimes though someone does and cherishes it. Sometimes someone seeks it. I think this forum is for everyone, like nature is, but especially for those who seek and want more from it.
What for one man is just a scent, for another may be beauty and a way of life.

 

[MzM]

I just feel like u made a problem out of nothing and are forcing a solution to it. Leave it alone. If ppl only wanna sell the oud then so be it. At least they are here and at least ppl benefit from obtaining the oils, and clearly they themselves are also buying oils. Forcing ppl to comment around the forum to have access to the marketplace is odd. As for taking the time to post here, I felt I can chip in and be a worthwhile 2 cents, especially considering the echo chamber is quite powerful around here , let along the clique and elite sorta vibes with the undertone of which particular sect dominates conversation generally speaking ... Obviously more ppl are buying and interested in that aspect of oud than they are about talking about it or typing it out. Perhaps it's difficult to put into words for some or they have other reasons not to participate. Why penalize them, I don't think any good will come from it. Perhaps u will just force ppl to post nonsense to gain access, would that be what u want from the forum? How will u judge the genuine contributers then or would it matter? This is such a small group of devotees , I don't see a reason to fracture it any more. Instead promote conversation by reward structure perhaps, or make it a more inclusive environment rather than elitist. Or just come out with it and block the marketplace for non paying members. I'm sure that will accomplish the goal also.

Thanks for your input Bilal, I personally did not think this was rude, I can't possibly know your tone and I gave the benefit of doubt. I am in the minority it seems haha.

 

[Bilalw]

Long post...
Thank you @Bilalw, you took time to offer your opinion. Per stats, 50 people viewed and there are 91 post. 49 of those post were made by vendors/mods, the other 42 by active members. Of the 50 that viewed the post 11 were vendors/mods and 39 were active members, of which only 14 responded. @Bilalw was one of the 14 out of 39 that cared to share, thank you. Also, there are 731 total members, roughly 15 or so are vendor/mods, I would expect active member's post to far outnumber that from vendor/mods, but they don't, why? The issue is active member participation, which as @Bilalw eluded to is cyclical and depends on interest. Truthfully, suggestions of vendor education are cool but they miss the mark as the forum has experienced past periods of way more activity without it.

I belong to several product oriented boards, none have the producers/vendors of the products as members. This site is a product focused platform, we discuss products and with vendors there it will never be truly open. Consider, the vendors know who the person in the avatar is in many cases, what they purchased, when, how many, etc., which makes giving honest appraisal and discussion very awkward. So as @Bilalw mentioned, reviews and discussion of oils end up feeling more like advertisement than honest appraisal, in essence it becomes an extension of the vendor's product page, which becomes boring and not really helpful to the consumer. I've mentioned several times, for example, that I highly rate Habz Alamin Malinau, up there with the likes of Borneo Diesel and Kencana V3 in my honest opinion. Imagine if I didn't experience it so and said I think it's subpar, IMO not worth a quarter of its price, and among the long line of Malinau oils I've tried, I rate it dead last, thumbs down. I gave my opinion and didn't say it was fake, so no foul there or breaking of the open forum's rules, but as an influential person on the board, me saying that could negatively impact sales of that oil, that's a fact, and could ruin our 'friendship'. The mods, vendor, and you @Ouddict know my statement can be impactful as well. What happens then, is the post censored, edited, deleted, left to stand knowing that although it's an opinion and not rule violating, it may affect him; get's tricky protecting the member's right to be open and protecting the vendor. The more I think about it, I wonder how feasible it is for the duality to coexist.

I recall a time when many wondered about the identity of the other forum's owner, many including vendors felt that some had multiple personalities when on one board vs another in behavior and how they spoke of oils. The other board was primarily comprised of contributors that supported a particular vendor's product, didn't take a genius to know that, but many had issue with it. But if you think about it realistically and without any emotional devotion, what separates that board from this? That one had members that raved about one vendor's product, boring, and this forum has members that rave about several vendor's products, boring after a while; no real openness about products, extension of vendor blurb.

@Ouddict just as strategic planning is important in cybersecurity to stay ahead of crooks that work 24/7, so it is here. You and management team have to figure out direction you want to go in, which you have options that may be more viable than others.
1. Leave as is with understanding that member participation is cyclical, while understanding the difficulty in the duality of protecting member right to be open vs protecting vendor?
2. Enlist vendors to offer 'education' that isn't just marketing masquerading as knowledge and offers more than what can be found using google-fu?

My suggestion, completely remove the vendors from consumer speak, the lack of vendors on the old BN Oud Majlis is what made it great and much more open; vendor politics, vendor and vendor shills like Ali Senjgeki or whatever the name, was a major part of the downfall. Truthfully as it is now it's kinda creeepy, I see a member mention their SOTD and the next thing I see is the vendor come in and comment about their oil; makes me wonder if they're sitting somewhere lurking, stalking and waiting for the opportunity to do so I've seen it happen so much lately. If I mention your oil or an oil I got from you as a vendor, it's not an invitation to initiate conversation about it with me or to comment how great you think it is, creepy, to ME. Let the members and vendors know that the consumer speak is protected unless it violates rules and let vendors know they can't win with thin skin; criticism of your product, good, service, person, etc comes with the territory. Maintain the vendor sections and members can go as they choose. Vendors can engage in commercial endeavors, answer questions, and educate in their own space to their hearts desire as long as it's not spoofing or attempting to debunk another vendor's ideas, concepts, products, etc. For example, I wouldn't expect to see convo about the term kinam/kyara in oil naming or oil smelling like wood on low heat is misleading on the Pearl section, they're another vendor's concepts. IMO the only reason a vendor talks about another vendor's concepts, ideas, stuff, etc. is when they can't come up with their own.

That is just scratching the surface of possible reasons why members aren't active; figure out the rest. Use the stats to see periods of high vs low activity and what caused them, look at the other forums such as BN and gaharu and what caused their closure or reduced activity, look at issues that caused exodus from participation here etc. and you'll begin to scratch the surface on possible ways to revitalize member participation, because without member participation outside of the market it'll just be the vendors talking amongst and patting each other on the back like what's happened in much of this thread. That's about as helpful I can be without going into a whole bunch of BS that has occured or I see here, hope it helps.

That's a good suggestion and good insight. Thanks for spelling it out. Of course they will say : but we are oud lovers too! Well it sure is hard to separate personal and business isn't it. Thanks, hope some ppl take heed.

 

[Faizal_p]

I guess we could have some rules regarding what a vendor can say however don't forget even on bn vendors are allowed to have an account. You're just not allowed to promote your own business.