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Alkhadra

"Master Kafeel" Resident Artisan
Heating Al Hashimi Maluku Malaki

Unfortunately I heated a bunk piece,
it turns out 35% were bad,
and some pieces had suspect patches which look like glue. In all fairness, I did not purchase these directly
from Al Hashimi, but rather through a fellow ouddict.
.

It makes me really sad seeing you post this. Bunk....35% were bad?

Maluku.jpg



This is a photo of the entire batch. It was a micro-batch. Every single piece sank so I don't know where 35% bunk comes from. Does it even look 35% bunk?
Bunk is literally uninfected white wood. :(

Worst of all. You're saying that some pieces had suspect patches that look like glue.

MM.jpg


The wood in this photo is Maluku Malaki. These are resin/oil ducts due to high grade of infection. If there were any glue, there'd be no need to suspect. Your eyes would water and you'd start coughing immediately upon burning/heating. Lastly, glue is usually something not visible on the outside. Especially not on small pieces like this. Glue is usually found in bigger pieces, and on the inside to hold it together.

So....:confused:
 
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AbasFrag

Oud Burner
Woah I totally missed that post :O

It makes me really sad and I take it personally because this batch was checked piece by piece by me. What you have referred to as "glue" patches is part of what makes Maluku Malaki one of the most amazing wood I have ever held in my hands. I still have a few grams that I only heat a sliver of on special occasions.

If you guys knew how much work and stress it takes to get wood like that, from the other side of the globe to me here in Sweden. Then when it is time to sell it, I'm always so hyped for the parcels to arrive to the costumers. I think more hyped than they are. I want them to experience what I experienced etc etc etc....

Then a comment like this comes and it really harms. Not that you didn't like it, that is normal and we all have different taste. Although this batch is like I said, one of the most amazing I have smelled (you can read my notes here: https://alhashimi.com/shop/maluku/) but when someone accuse me of selling glue and bunk wood then it is a completely different matter.

And talking about "glue".. let me show you some more pieces of "glue". But this is Philippines "glue" and the people who bought them are respected members of this forum and the reviews speak for themselves.

1-1.jpg
WhatsApp-Image-2018-11-17-at-8.45.51-AM-1-e1546030466918.jpeg.jpg
WhatsApp-Image-2018-11-17-at-8.45.51-AM-2.jpeg.jpg
 

EJayB

True Ouddict
Dang Oudamberlove I want to buy that “bunk” wood ,it looks amazing ...... I love wood with the resin inside that looks like obsidian! It melts out of the wood like butter. Sorry you didn’t dig it but no worries just send it my way and I’ll get it right on my subitism immediately. Seriously
 

Mr.P

oud<3er
This is odd. I have come to trust 100% oudamberlove’s comments, and his experience with wood and incense speaks for itself. I don’t think I’ve seen anyone with the consistent level-headed approach to sampling and sharing impressions.

So I accept the 30% bunk and glue observation as accurate. Oudamberlove does not drop bombs for no reason and knows his shit better than anyone else here BY FAR (LOOK at his post history and lack of conflict of interest here as a non-vendor. No endless self-promotion, no bragging about superior products. Just an amateur with lots of experience.

Given the strong reassurance that the wood was inspected piece by piece by the vendor, and making the assumption that they are speaking truthfully, I have to conclude that the middle man who sold the chips to oudamberlove tampered with them.

It is hard and risky to write honest reviews about less than wonderful experiences here, with the strong vendor presence.
 

EJayB

True Ouddict
Even when a person is speaking kind words about a product on this site people get very offended ,if every part of the description doesn’t fit the narrative they subscribe to.
If a person buys something second hand and it seems off they probably got took for a ride.
We as a group should refrain from bashing first party vendors if the purchase was a third party
Purchase. I honestly have stoped purchases from non-vendor third party salesman.
unless totally verified. Oudamberlove bought that wood but will he resell it? Probably not because he’s a solid guy that you can trust.
But not every person jumping up on the site is as honest as I know Oudamberlove to be.
It’s a risk buying from third party, did they buy an expensive oil and pull out a bit and dilute with something? Is it what it’s supposed to be truly? Buy from trusted vendors or ouddicts not third party sellers is my advice. And if you do buy third party make sure to list the seller of that item not just who that seller said they got it from. Total fairness
Mr P do you get offended when people publicly bash on you based not on your own actions but the word of a third party? I herd ......
Without the vendors hard work and dedication this site wouldn’t exist . Rather then constantly complaining about the format wouldn’t it be better to start a new non/vendor forum?
Complaining is easy getting that dream site up is hard work and expensive and then someone will complain about how it was formatted or...
 

Ouddict

Ouddict Co-Founder & Tech Support
This is odd. I have come to trust 100% oudamberlove’s comments, and his experience with wood and incense speaks for itself. I don’t think I’ve seen anyone with the consistent level-headed approach to sampling and sharing impressions.

So I accept the 30% bunk and glue observation as accurate. Oudamberlove does not drop bombs for no reason and knows his shit better than anyone else here BY FAR (LOOK at his post history and lack of conflict of interest here as a non-vendor. No endless self-promotion, no bragging about superior products. Just an amateur with lots of experience.

Given the strong reassurance that the wood was inspected piece by piece by the vendor, and making the assumption that they are speaking truthfully, I have to conclude that the middle man who sold the chips to oudamberlove tampered with them.

It is hard and risky to write honest reviews about less than wonderful experiences here, with the strong vendor presence.

While I agree with your assessment of @Oudamberlove and his honesty, please don't slur the reputation of this forum and make insinuations that because there are vendors on here, somehow the management is bias towards them. In what way is it "hard and risky to write honest reviews" on this forum? Those words are a direct two-fingers up at my integrity and the integrity of the non-vendor admins and moderators who spend their time helping run this forum fairly for all members. Being a customer does not make you or anyone else a paragon of virtue and if folks want to see what a real vendor run and censored forum looks like, they know exactly where to go.

Let me give you some food for thought:

1. The number of reviews by vendors on the main section censored/deleted/moved by admin since the inception of Ouddict in 2016 = 30+
2. The number of reviews by members on the main section censored/deleted/moved by admin since the inception of Ouddict in 2016 = 1 (and that was for a non-forum vendor who complained - AmeenAroma, back in 2017)

If anything, this forum gives our vendors a pretty hard time and zero favours and its a thankless task for the admin when we hear baseless accusations like this. If we were biased, the first thing I would have done is to remove that review and any like it.

You forget that I am personally involved with Al Hashimi, but did not take that review down so less of the "all vendors are bad" message please. I think you forget that the Western Artisanal Oud market would not exist if it was not for vendors. We have a Resident Artisan space precisely so that vendors can market away on their and members are aware that these are commercial spaces. There is no room for commercial marketing on the main boards and where vendors have - very infrequently - overstepped the mark, I have taken action. Yes I even took action against some enthusiastic posts from Al Hashimi in our early days when I received a complaint that product reviews were appearing in the main section.

With some members on here, I detect a moral superiority complex because they are customers and think its open house to slander and disparage the very people who subsidise their Oud oil purchases. Yes I say subsidise because most vendors here have full time careers and can afford to sell oils and woods at stupidly low prices - its just that people think this is now their birthright and somehow the norm. It definitely is not.

As for @Oudamberlove's review, Al Hashimi's wood speaks for itself and has received nothing but praise from every customer we have sold to. I think it would have been fair for @Oudamberlove to have approached Al Hashimi for comment especially as this was a second-hand purchase. Every single piece is checked before it is sold so its beyond me how something like this would have happened. @Oudamberlove, I recommend that you contact @AbasFrag and let him investigate. Please also provide the details of the person who sold you this.
 

Ouddict

Ouddict Co-Founder & Tech Support
It makes me really sad seeing you post this. Bunk....35% were bad?

View attachment 12359


This is a photo of the entire batch. It was a micro-batch. Every single piece sank so I don't know where 35% bunk comes from. Does it even look 35% bunk?
Bunk is literally uninfected white wood. :(

Worst of all. You're saying that some pieces had suspect patches that look like glue.

View attachment 12360

The wood in this photo is Maluku Malaki. These are resin/oil ducts due to high grade of infection. If there were any glue, there'd be no need to suspect. Your eyes would water and you'd start coughing immediately upon burning/heating. Lastly, glue is usually something not visible on the outside. Especially not on small pieces like this. Glue is usually found in bigger pieces, and on the inside to hold it together.

So....:confused:


@Oudamberlove are you referring to these dark resin areas as glue? If so, you have made a serious error. And where is your post? I cannot see it.
 
I wish not to mention whom I purchased the wood from.

I also edited out my comment not too long after I posted it, because in hind sight I figured it was not tasteful, and I don’t want to talk about it any further.

Al Hashimi has a great reputation, and it should stay that way.
 
@Oudamberlove are you referring to these dark resin areas as glue? If so, you have made a serious error. And where is your post? I cannot see it.
This is one of the pieces which I deemed “suspect” of glue, but I didn’t heat it to be on the safe side, after all it may be harmful to inhale if it is, but I did not guarantee it to be glue, so in a sense, I did not accuse anyone of selling me a glued piece.
E69D33B9-12D4-4525-87DB-D16961D35DF3.jpeg
 

Ouddict

Ouddict Co-Founder & Tech Support
I wish not to mention whom I purchased the wood from.

I also edited out my comment not too long after I posted it, because in hind sight I figured it was not tasteful, and I don’t want to talk about it any further.

Al Hashimi has a great reputation, and it should stay that way.


While I have nothing but respect for you, since you brought this to attention publicly and if the reseller is an Ouddict member, the forum management should investigate this. As a customer, you have every right to draw attention to sub-par products, so feel free to approach one of the admins @jensz or @riviera274 if this was sold by a member on Ouddict. They can investigate and if needed, involve the original vendor.
 
And this is one of the bunk pieces. It looks absolutely wonderful, so it would certainly pass any eye examination by whomever sells it.
But when heated, it is not the same as the others in the batch and smells a little rancid.
A87B2B0F-DC84-453D-9C34-4F1D8842165F.jpeg
 

Ouddict

Ouddict Co-Founder & Tech Support
And this is one of the bunk pieces. It looks absolutely wonderful, so it would certainly pass any eye examination by whomever sells it.
But when heated, it is not the same as the others in the batch and smells a little rancid.
View attachment 12374

The problem is that there is no way of knowing whether that piece was added by the reseller. I think you really should contact @jensz and @riviera274 if the person who sold this to you want on Ouddict. If they were not on Ouddict, then contact @AbasFrag and let him know who the reseller was and he can at least confirm whether this customer has purchased this wood and investigate further.
 

Rai Munir

Musk Man
Well, a couple of years before, most probably in 2018, Tyson posted about the glue filled and shrapnel embedded wood that he acquired from Ensar. I think he wrote in detail about the wood and about the correspondence he had with the Ensar Oud officials. Vietnam war and shrapnel got penetrated into Agarwood. This was the punch line that time. Since then, everybody acquires, if a log or in bulk, with care and caution.

So, this post by respected Oudamberlove has the same nature except one thing: Tyson mentioned the seller and shared his experience. Anyway, now time has changed a bit.
 
Well, a couple of years before, most probably in 2018, Tyson posted about the glue filled and shrapnel embedded wood that he acquired from Ensar. I think he wrote in detail about the wood and about the correspondence he had with the Ensar Oud officials. Vietnam war and shrapnel got penetrated into Agarwood. This was the punch line that time. Since then, everybody acquires, if a log or in bulk, with care and caution.

So, this post by respected Oudamberlove has the same nature except one thing: Tyson mentioned the seller and shared his experience. Anyway, now time has changed a bit.
I bought it from one of the most respected long time member of ouddict, and shared the name only with Nadeem. I will feel disgraced if I publicize who it was.
I honestly feel that the vendors here at ouddict will not knowingly pass a bad piece onto a buyer. Should a vendor heat every single tiny piece they sell, I pray not. I’ve purchased many batches with errant pieces, I accept that to be the norm, if you get a perfect batch, well and good.
 

Mr.P

oud<3er
Ah guys chill. What did I say that pissed you off - that people may not feel comfortable posting negative stuff at a vendor populated forum? How is that controversial? And who complained about any of our vendors here? I just said the third party who sold it to oudamberlove was likely the culprit BECAUSE of my respect for the reputable vendors here. I mean, be mad if you want to but I think you need to chill out just a little.
 

Habz786

Resident Artisan & Ouddict Co-Founder
@Oudamberlove knows his stuff and like you said looking at pieces and heating them is two different things (unlikely any vendor will heat all pieces). Pieces can look great but smell rubbish, i dont think any vendor would intentionally sell rubbish wood but only being human it can happen. Its been the case with Ensar whos been at it for a while and could also be a case with any vendor tommorow. I think maybe your post came across slightly harsh or taken the wrong way but its nothing major just a rubbish chip ammoungst a batch of wood really.
 

Rai Munir

Musk Man
Respected Curt, it's fine. And on your part, you did the best what you considered to be the best.
Even if the name (renowned or to be renowned or unknown), were there, it would have been a little bit beneficial which actually serves the purpose of forums. But it is just my personal and subjective view point.

But in Market Section, the rules and regulations compel the buyer to comment. This is why Trade History is there.
 
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