Extracting the unextractable

[MaxFromHolland]

Or 'bio-active headspace extraction' 🤓

Those that follow my musings ramblings (brave souls) may know that i very much like that typical forestfloor scent of decay.
Poor me, it is a scent that can't be captured by extracting whatever it is, smelling so great. That's because you're not smelling the leaves, barks, wood and soil. The material actually smells of nothing much at all because the decay breaks down volatiles fast while other persistent aromatics were long ago rain-washed away by the time you harvest.
No, that lovely forest floor scent isn't coming from the botanicals at all. What you are smelling are the millions of tiny farts of ever so many tiny creatures like fungi and bacteria (pardon the poetry). And while they too end up in the jar with ethanol, they will no longer produce aromatics, being now very much dead.

But picture this:
A terrarium kind of large glass box, near a sun facing window (or outdoors);
Filled with fresh harvest which' scent you seek to capture;
Properly covered with a light coloured metal tray that has
- a layer of some suitable odourless fat at the bottom side
- a layer of water to evaporate and as such keeping the lid cool on top;

Now the fungi and bacteria stay happily alive, the day-night cycle will maintain natures' evaporation and condensation cycles;
That so much desired scent will be airborne constantly and eventually gets trapped in the thin fat layer, just like the process of enfleurage;
Time and patience will do the rest, until eventually the fat is properly saturated. Then it can be processed same as enfleurage.

Details.. Add some sort of metal frame with coarse muslin, to be suspended around 1/5th of the top to absorb evaporating moisture so that doesn't constantly condensate on the lid and may wash away the goods.
Maybe construct the lid tapered to reduce the size of the fat layer, maybe more actively chill the lid with a light water flow? Idk.


Ref.
• IFF: Living Flower Technology
• Givaudan: ScentTrek
• Firmenich: NaturePrint
• Mane: Jungle Essence
Though they tend to capture, GC-MS, recreate.
• More to read: https://blog.delacourte.com/en/head-spaces-or-nature-print/

 

[Mr.P]

Or 'bio-active headspace extraction' 🤓

Those that follow my musings ramblings (brave souls) may know that i very much like that typical forestfloor scent of decay.
Poor me, it is a scent that can't be captured by extracting whatever it is, smelling so great. That's because you're not smelling the leaves, barks, wood and soil. The material actually smells of nothing much at all because the decay breaks down volatiles fast while other persistent aromatics were long ago rain-washed away by the time you harvest.
No, that lovely forest floor scent isn't coming from the botanicals at all. What you are smelling are the millions of tiny farts of ever so many tiny creatures like fungi and bacteria (pardon the poetry). And while they too end up in the jar with ethanol, they will no longer produce aromatics, being now very much dead.

But picture this:
A terrarium kind of large glass box, near a sun facing window (or outdoors);
Filled with fresh harvest which' scent you seek to capture;
Properly covered with a light coloured metal tray that has
- a layer of some suitable odourless fat at the bottom side
- a layer of water to evaporate and as such keeping the lid cool on top;

Now the fungi and bacteria stay happily alive, the day-night cycle will maintain natures' evaporation and condensation cycles;
That so much desired scent will be airborne constantly and eventually gets trapped in the thin fat layer, just like the process of enfleurage;
Time and patience will do the rest, until eventually the fat is properly saturated. Then it can be processed same as enfleurage.

Details.. Add some sort of metal frame with coarse muslin, to be suspended around 1/5th of the top to absorb evaporating moisture so that doesn't constantly condensate on the lid and may wash away the goods.
Maybe construct the lid tapered to reduce the size of the fat layer, maybe more actively chill the lid with a light water flow? Idk.


Ref.
• IFF: Living Flower Technology
• Givaudan: ScentTrek
• Firmenich: NaturePrint
• Mane: Jungle Essence
Though they tend to capture, GC-MS, recreate.
• More to read: https://blog.delacourte.com/en/head-spaces-or-nature-print/

The goal of trying to capture those beautiful delicate exhalations of healthy soil is a noble one (perhaps quixotic but nothing ventured, nothing gained) and it does seem like enfleurage would be the technique that is likely to have a chance of capturing something delicate like that! I suppose you could also have a terrarium with a recirculating air pump and a bubbler in line and just constantly recirculate the air through a bubbler of some kind (maybe one of those diffusing stones to increase surface area of the bubbles) to infuse a liquid in a similar manner with whatever is in the air, but I have no idea if any fragrance would be absorbed that way or how long it would take.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

The goal of trying to capture those beautiful delicate exhalations of healthy soil is a noble one (perhaps quixotic but nothing ventured, nothing gained) and it does seem like enfleurage would be the technique that is likely to have a chance of capturing something delicate like that! I suppose you could also have a terrarium with a recirculating air pump and a bubbler in line and just constantly recirculate the air through a bubbler of some kind (maybe one of those diffusing stones to increase surface area of the bubbles) to infuse a liquid in a similar manner with whatever is in the air, but I have no idea if any fragrance would be absorbed that way or how long it would take.

There is a disadvantage to a bubbler, that the terrarium air is moist and that moisture would end up in de bubbler too. So that requires a coldtrap, or maybe a clever designed bubbler could seperate oil and water, returning the water back to the terrarium.
On the other hand it would avoid the need to wash the fat with associated risk of losing light volatiles while processing the alcohol.
Definitely an alternative to consider!

 

[Mr.P]

There is a disadvantage to a bubbler, that the terrarium air is moist and that moisture would end up in de bubbler too. So that requires a coldtrap, or maybe a clever designed bubbler could seperate oil and water, returning the water back to the terrarium.
On the other hand it would avoid the need to wash the fat with associated risk of losing light volatiles while processing the alcohol.
Definitely an alternative to consider!

I suspect that that aroma may be something to do with texture and environment and may not be possible to make by diffusing things off of an inert surface or skin.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

I suspect that that aroma may be something to do with texture and environment and may not be possible to make by diffusing things off of an inert surface or skin.

Not sure i understand what you are saying here?

 

[Mr.P]

maybe certain types of aromatic experiences are a function of the shape and humidity and texture and mixture of things in an environment and when they get reduced to a pool of liquid something is lost? This is just a guess! Perhaps better worded as a question: is it possible that there are olfactory experiences that cannot be carried in the form of a liquid?

 

[Mr.P]

for example I love the smell of old dried beds of white pine needles. When I extracted it I can tell that the aroma that I like has been extracted but the experience diffusing the extract is really nothing like the experience of walking across a bed of the needles. It may be that they smell I like is not the smell of the oil in the needles but the smell of the needles themselves and the particular way they are diffusing in the context of the environment they are diffusing into.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

for example I love the smell of old dried beds of white pine needles. When I extracted it I can tell that the aroma that I like has been extracted but the experience diffusing the extract is really nothing like the experience of walking across a bed of the needles. It may be that they smell I like is not the smell of the oil in the needles but the smell of the needles themselves and the particular way they are diffusing in the context of the environment they are diffusing into.

Ah got it. Guess you could test that by collecting a good bunch and place them out of context, like on top of a garden table and see if you experience the scent different?

I think in general there are 2 questions:
Do i smell the botanical?
Do i smell the botanical + environment?

In first case:
Do i smell the botanical? -> one of the common extraction methods
Do i smell the decay of the botanical? -> subject of this post

In second case:
If the environment is part of the picture then it all depends on whether you can isolate it. The scent of ferns on a stack of decaying tree stems might be possible (it's possible to build a dome over an area of interest). Pine needles + surrounding trees probably not so much 🙂

But then, if a fairly simple diy project could harvest even just a single one of those uncatchable scents, it would be a bottle to cherish..

 

[Mr.P]

Ah got it. Guess you could test that by collecting a good bunch and place them out of context, like on top of a garden table and see if you experience the scent different?

I think in general there are 2 questions:
Do i smell the botanical?
Do i smell the botanical + environment?

In first case:
Do i smell the botanical? -> one of the common extraction methods
Do i smell the decay of the botanical? -> subject of this post

In second case:
If the environment is part of the picture then it all depends on whether you can isolate it. The scent of ferns on a stack of decaying tree stems might be possible (it's possible to build a dome over an area of interest). Pine needles + surrounding trees probably not so much 🙂

But then, if a fairly simple diy project could harvest even just a single one of those uncatchable scents, it would be a bottle to cherish..

well the way you're approaching things is very interesting, I'm glad you're sharing your thoughts here. The closest thing I think that I've been struggling with is trying to capture that smell that emerges from white pine. It's not the smell of the pine itself, I'm sure I mentioned this a couple of times but it's the old desiccated needles that seem to release the aroma (confirmed by bringing them into my home).

If I could somehow capture and release that scent to create the same aromatic ambience that I experience in the woods I would be overjoyed.

The closest I've gotten is just bringing a bunch of the needles indoors. I have this paste like extract that I can tell comes from those needles but it smell smells like the ratio of the different constituents is changed in the extract (among other things) and it's just not the same. I have to go see where that's at though I haven't smelled it in a month or so