Kyara/Kynam: IS IT REALLY OUD?

[Rai Munir]

Oh no no, my dear and respected Varat, I mentioned my focus in the thread is Kyara. Otherwise, who the hell I am to raise objection on any post. Respected powdernose is there to glare and admonish. And he never spares.

To be honest, after reading respected and dearest powdernose and Joe's posts, I went through the whole thread. Then your post was there. I had really missed some very important points that you people mentioned.

My last post is all about my concern the discussion keep continuing. Anyone might not become silent.

To be honest, Kynam's being a cultivated one as well is shocking for me. Otherwise, in 2017, first I stood up and became attentive first, and uttered the word 'Kynam'. Hype. Marketing! In 2018, when I found Kynam is available quite easily, but at a high price, I kept sitting when pronouncing Kynam. And by the end of 2018, and till the last three months, the Kynam oils turned into some unknown profile, and Kynam got distempered in white, black, green, and I think yellow Kynam as well. Evolution!

Now it is cultivated. Wow! GCMS is needed to authenticate its being genuine. I think none has raised objection on Alex' words about Kynam cultivated. If some queries are, they are about the GCMS of the wood respected Alex possessed.



Edit: Correction made

 

[VPhong]

Oh no no, my dear and respected Varat, I mentioned my focus in the thread is Kyara. Otherwise, who the hell I am to raise objection on any post. Respected Admin powdernose is there to glare and admonish. And he never spares.

To be honest, after reading respected and dearest powdernose and Joe's posts, I went through the whole thread. Then your post was there. I had really missed some very important points that you people mentioned.

My last post is all about my concern the discussion keep continuing. Anyone might not become silent.

To be honest, Kynam's being a cultivated one as well is shocking for me. Otherwise, in 2017, first I stood up and became attentive first, and uttered the word 'Kynam'. Hope. Marketing! In 2018, when I found Kynam is available quite easily, but at a high price, I kept sitting when producing Kynam. And by the end of 2018, and till the last three months, the Kynam oils turned into some unknown profile, and Kynam got distempered in white, black, green, and I think yellow Kynam as well. Evolution!

Now it is cultivated. Wow! GCMS is needed to authenticate its being genuine. I think none has raised objection on Alex' words about Kynam cultivated. If some queries are, they are about the GCMS of the wood respected Alex possessed.

Who the hell are you indeed ! ? ! dear Rai Munir
You are a kind heart man who sees the best in people

Well being the skeptic that I am, concerning this matter I would like to see cultivated kinam verified by a trusted source we can all accept/or the majority of us anyways. That would be the ideal situation.

 

[Alex]

I understand what kinam is. I have read the references you provided and they did nothing to confirm your claims.
You have not shown a baseline study of kinam that correlates with the piece of wood you provided for testing.
Also the following issues raised by Ouddict and Powdernose have not been properly answered/addressed.
Until they are and you can show the wood you used for testing matches a known piece of kinam it all just appears to be an attempt to pull the wool over peoples eyes and bambozzle them with lots of words. The wood you supplied for testing could have been a very low grade of agarwood....

Ouddict-
"You do realise that the lab test - although interesting - does not have much value until it is baselined against a known signature test result right? "
"Sure, what you have done is great - you have sent a sample of 'kinam' to a lab who have conducted a GCMS test on it. Nowhere in that test does the lab confirm that it is kinam - they simply cannot do that, unless they have a reference signature from a known/verified library and compare it to confirm."

- a known signature test result is what I mentioned in the post and uploaded the pages also check my post number #91 here it i again
1- list of sesquiterpenes from agarwood oils / agarwood by Rozi Mohamed / tropical forest / springer / page 109
2- list of sesquiterpenes from agarwood oils / agarwood by Rozi Mohamed / tropical forest / springer / page 110
3- Molecules 2018, 23, 2969 research - headspace gas chromatography - page 4
4- Sesquiterpenes and Chromones of Agarwood - by Daoud Ahmaed and Ajaykumar page 37
5- Sesquiterpenes and Chromones of Agarwood - by Daoud Ahmaed and Ajaykumar page 38
6- there is another one from Harvard Botany department pretty much saying the same thing (I can't find it now)

Powdernose-
"Thanks for posting your result.
What precisely did you test?"

- what we tested is a kinam wood (cultivated kinam wood that is 5 years in age / THERE IS NO WILD KINAM) I mentioned this and answered his question in details in post number #107

"I looked through your posted references, I don't think I saw a single common component.
Am I missing something?"

- I answered this question and uploaded the pages my answer was post number #107

Alex said: ↑
I wasn't talking about any wild kinam to start talking about cultivated kinam, I'm talking about cultivated kinam from the beginning
Powdernose-At no point was this clear!
This is how you presented your report:

- this is very sad as this is an Oud or agrawood forum and the respectful members of it believe that I or anyone else has, selling, or offering wild kinam (which with all do respect funny to hear to anyone who is remotely involved in kiman but it's my fault and I'm sorry I thought this is a well known fact to everyone that is dealing, working, or well-versed in this field).

Alex said: ↑
FYI for anyone who's interested in knowing what a Kyara/kinam GC analysis looks like, here it is from The Perfumist
Powdernose-I also asked point blank what precisely you tested and your reply was:
"Kinam, kinam, kinam"

Both statements are misleading.

- I addressed this point multiple times and said that all kinam is cultivated and here I'm saying it for the 20th time (ALL KINAM IS CULTIVATED)
I answered this in post number #107 and I'm quoting
"- kinam, kinam, kinam, many people/companies are doing eau de toilette with 100% chemical components and calling it kinam, companies are not responsible they always want to make money we are responsible of searching, asking, and learning about what a word really means ."


Alex said: ↑
6- Santalol, cis,α- (reference Molecules 2018, 23, 2969 page 5)
Powdernose-Yes, you've managed a single match, in your test that component is at 0.01%...

- I answered this in details in post number #111 here is my quoted answer
No it does here are the NIST identifications marked for you with exact reference and page number from where that reference is from
1- α-Guaiene (refrence Daoud Tajeldeinn Ahmaed and Ajaykumar D. Kulkarni page 38)
2- 11-dien (refrence Daoud Tajeldeinn Ahmaed and Ajaykumar D. Kulkarni page 38)
3- 11-dien (refrence agarwood my rozi mohamed page 109)
4- Guaia-1(10) (refrence Daoud Tajeldeinn Ahmaed and Ajaykumar D. Kulkarni page 38)
5- benzaldehyde in that range of quantitation (20 to 30) (refrence Daoud Tajeldeinn Ahmaed and Ajaykumar D. Kulkarni page 38)
6- Santalol, cis,α- (reference Molecules 2018, 23, 2969 page 5)
7- 2-Butanone, 4-phenyl- (reference Molecules 2018, 23, 2969 page 7)
8- 1H,5H-Pyrazolo[1,2-a][1,2,4]triazole-1-thione, tetrahydro-2-phenyl-3-(3-pyridinyl)-
4-Methoxybenzyl phenyl carbonate
4-Amino-5-(5-amino-4 phenyl-1-pyrazolyl)methyl-2-methylpyrimidine
4-phenyl-
( available on our report on 2 , 29 , 30 , 32 presenting different varieties of phenylethyl, with amino, this is used the decide the quality of agarwood and even the region distinguishing different kinds of it and I'm quoting from Molecules 2018, 23, 2969 page 11 reference (20/25) "
chromones were identified in the incense smoke of the Kynam variety (27.23%), but not in the same of Vietnamese, Lao, or Cambodian variety. So far, 39 different 2-(2-phenylethyl) chromone derivatives have been identified in different varieties of agarwood).

Alex said: ↑
7- 2-Butanone, 4-phenyl- (reference Molecules 2018, 23, 2969 page 7)
Powdernose-That is not a component found in the kyara study you reference:
https://www.mdpi.com/1420-3049/23/11/2969/htm#B21-molecules-23-02969
rather it is mentioned in the study but the actual reference is this one:
https://www.researchgate.net/file.P...fe6&assetKey=AS:395028015927297@1471193426523
which is with regard to regular agarwood not kynam.

Alex said: ↑
8- 1H,5H-Pyrazolo[1,2-a][1,2,4]triazole-1-thione, tetrahydro-2-phenyl-3-(3-pyridinyl)-
4-Methoxybenzyl phenyl carbonate
4-Amino-5-(5-amino-4 phenyl-1-pyrazolyl)methyl-2-methylpyrimidine
4-phenyl-
( available on our report on 2 , 29 , 30 , 32 presenting different varieties of phenylethyl, with amino, this is used the decide the quality of agarwood and even the region distinguishing different kinds of it and I'm quoting from Molecules 2018, 23, 2969 page 11 reference (20/25) "
chromones were identified in the incense smoke of the Kynam variety (27.23%), but not in the same of Vietnamese, Lao, or Cambodian variety. So far, 39 different 2-(2-phenylethyl) chromone derivatives have been identified in different varieties of agarwood).
Powdernose - None of those are chromones.
By the way, you can't just take one section of a chemical components name and make matches based on that partial name....
Also worth noting that a GCMS of smoke will differ to a test of an acetone extract.

- (Powdernose is obviously not familiar with any of those components read my post #117) here Powdernose said that non of those are chromones
and I quoted from
- benzaldehyde and 2-phenylethyl are not Chromones ?
again I'm using the same quote " analyzed the smoke profiles of two different varieties of Vietnamese agarwood that
were absorbed in Tenax TA, and found small amounts of benzaldehyde and 2-(2-phenylethyl) chromone
were present in both varieties of Kynam (Kanakoh) agarwood. Ismail et al (kindly note the WORD CHROMONES in the quote)

And by the by, 1,2,4 triazoles are synthetic compounds
"The 1, 2, 4-triazole ring is an ubiquitous structural feature of many synthetic compounds"
https://japer.in/storage/models/art...8TQEaBxRIIDuC/a-review-on-1-2-4-triazoles.pdf

- I answered that question in the same post post #117 and here is the my answer quoted
- Dear again with all do respect I hope you are not simply googling those components and you actually do have some experience in the chemical field and the lab testing understanding as what is mentioned here is "[1,2,4]triazole-1-thione" and this is natural, and when it comes with this kind of formation it's not only natural but obviously from plant based material that been producing anti-fungi components here is a simply scientific reference to what I just mentioned, you can actually google this and you will get an answer.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23760033
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I believed I answered all the questions that was listed for the second time now, again if there is any other questions I'm always ready to the best of my experience and knowledge
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finally dear Oud lovers I feel that I hit some nerve by posting a real authentic lab test that technically cost thousands of dollars and months of work while some other members quoted and used some published test with no authentication, no reference number, no names of the people who done it or made it, and not even the kind of extraction or the way the oil was taken.

I also feel that I hit a never or busted a bubble when I said that there is no WILD KINAM, as I believe at least some respectful members in the forum had no idea about this BASIC FACT!.

also I have only quoted and listed top scientific and academic references here are the references that I used and listed and directly quoted with book name, published, and page number, and I was presented or opposed by random KINMA test that was published in some Chinese magazine, with no reference, no names if the people who done it and no name of the lab or institute that it was one in, and a MISTAKEN thought that benzaldehyde and 2-phenylethyl are not Chromones, and accusation of not answering questions and being showy.

finally I posted and presented REAL pictures of kinam farms and the kind of wood (kinam) that is being CULTIVATED or sold and elaborated to the people here the different kinds of it and the ages it takes which no company or person on this forum done which is quite honestly strange because anyone who is involved, working, selling, buying kinam know this as a basic fact (very sadly some companies or sellers are selling it or promoting it as WILD! I sincerely hope that no people or members on this forum or reading this fault for that before).

with all that been said and the time and effort that's been invested I feel many member intentional or unintentionally feel that I'm trying to sell or promote something, or I'm dishonest and untrustworthy and for the honest and trustworthy part I leave it to everyone of this forum or anyone who read this post in details to decide and for the selling and promoting part they are defiantly right I'm trying to promote and sell the truth so others don't get tricked by greedy companies and sellers and get SCAMMED into buying or collecting what is called WILD KINAM. which I was surprised that many few respectful members thought I'm talking about not knowing that there is no WILD KINAM.

with all that been said, thank you for allowing me the opportunity to present our search and work and knowledge, and even if we may not fully agree with each other in some points, I think we all agree that science is science and facts are facts.

regards to all

 

[amanitamusc]

-

I also feel that I hit a never or busted a bubble when I said that there is no WILD KINAM, as I believe at least some respectful members in the forum had no idea about this BASIC FACT!.


regards to all

This is not basic fact.It is merely, YOUR OPINION.

 

[Alex]

Hi Alex, thank u for this very insightful post. I really appreciate this information it has brought some sense and awareness into me. I do understand that the farmers in certain countries had succession in utilising the grafting method to produce the acclaim green oil "kynam" , but to the extend of the last 2 picture is quite unbelievable to me. Please correct me if I am wrong, I am novice hobbyist here not an expert in any related field.

Sent from my A1601 using Tapatalk

yes dear it's correct to the inexpert eye the cultivated looks like high quality wild agawood (knowing that it is kinam, oe being sold as kinam makes it a fact that it is cultivated) my pleasure, always here to help

 

[Alex]

The number of posts by respected members here asking you for additional info/clarification/supporting evidence with regards to what you have presented are testament to the vague/questionable nature of your information. Ref Post #156 @Joe King has kindly highlighted the questionable points in his post

Well, since you asked here is my list.

Using the word “Kinam” in a product name without clear supporting evidence – That’s SHOWY to put it kindly

- all supporting evidence were provided, explained and elaborated again this was done, in a major USA lab, by a certified lab technician, authenticated by a PHD in chemistry, a professional botanist, and Ali Attar. I listed the references of the books and lab tests that we stood on and compared with. is all this not clear supporting evidence I'm not sure what is surprisingly many members here reference or opposed our work with a no reference lab test made by unknown party in china published in some unmentioned Chinese magazine and considered a proof!

Repeatedly justifying the identity of “Kinam” in a lower grade wood and attempting to nonchalantly suppress opposing views by means of superior scientific/academic credentials through incomplete and questionable findings – DOUBLE SHOWY

- Dear you can call it as much as you want, whatever you want, whenever you want showy, double showy, or even triply showy, with all do respect the fact is I have a referenced certified lab test from a major USA lab and 3 academic references to stand on that is considered the authority in agarwood in the word. if you have or know of any other company, seller, or provider that has done this and published (what they think or believe is kinam test kindly publish and post there test here and we will compare and observe in all subjective, respectful and friendly manner) other than that you are just expressing your opinion.

Telling stories and promoting one’s credentials to give bonus points to oneself at a time when you are being requested real viable answers - SHOWY

- members on this forum asked me for more information and I provided them with that information and everything I provide is even referenced and documented fact or personal on hand experience and knowledge that I stand behind 100% if documented facts and on-hand experience and knowledge is showy for you please except my apology this is the way we work.

Broadcasting one’s reputation as a non-profit member and community giver under questionable circumstances – Wow, to have that kind of audacity … that’s no shame, thick skin SHOWY. But I am glad to hear it and I would love to see that proven in time.

- OMG dear the lab test that I published has our company name and logo on it, my profile that I made every post from has our company name and logo, my user name is "the perfumist" which is our comapny name, I have clearly mentioned in the majority of post "our company" " the perfumist" "Ali Attar" I'm really not sure from where or why you got the feeling that we are a non profit company. we are a perfume house a company and not a non profit organization with that been said I don't think this prevent, stop, or shame us or any other company or house for that matter from publishing scientific facts and authentic lab report, educating others and spreading knowledge and awarness actually that is what are trying to do, (rather than promoting or offering what some may sell or present as wild kinam) we are listing our test, saying the truth and opening the door with a very warm and friendly invitation to all other sellers, companies and housed to be more scientific and real and present their work, findings and lab tests. I don't think there is anything showy or bad about that.

 

[Alex]

This is not basic fact.It is merely, YOUR OPINION.

would you be kind enough to direct me or mention any company or party that you know of or dealt with that own, selling, offering WILD KINAM, and what kind of proof or test they have and I will be indebted for you forever

 

[Joe King]

-
with all that been said and the time and effort that's been invested I feel many member intentional or unintentionally feel that I'm trying to sell or promote something, or I'm dishonest and untrustworthy and for the honest and trustworthy part I leave it to everyone of this forum or anyone who read this post in details to decide and for the selling and promoting part they are defiantly right I'm trying to promote and sell the truth so others don't get tricked by greedy companies and sellers and get SCAMMED into buying or collecting what is called WILD KINAM. which I was surprised that many few respectful members thought I'm talking about not knowing that there is no WILD KINAM.

alex we can disagree til the cows come home on whether you have shown any evidence that the wood you had tested is kinam.
But trying to say you are not trying to sell this wood as Kinam is a lie, the perfumist website has this for sale!
As @amanitamusc said your statement about wild kinam is only an opinion, and your opinion is just an opinion.
My opinion is that you and the perfumist are selling dubious products and the only truth you are promoting is just a sales pitch.
Just my opinion.

 

[amanitamusc]

would you be kind enough to direct me or mention any company or party that you know of or dealt with that own, selling, offering WILD KINAM, and what kind of proof or test they have and I will be indebted for you forever

You made the claim THERE IS NO WILD KINAM. The onus of proof is on you.
If you say there is nobody selling wild kinam that still does not prove there is no wild kinam.
Only that there is not any for sale that you know of.

 

[Joe King]

would you be kind enough to direct me or mention any company or party that you know of or dealt with that own, selling, offering WILD KINAM, and what kind of proof or test they have and I will be indebted for you forever

https://www.ebay.com.au/i/254213917449?ul_noapp=true
this is the same people who are farming and selling "plantation kinam"
and most likely where you get your "kinam" from.

 

[Alex]

Oh no no, my dear and respected Varat, I mentioned my focus in the thread is Kyara. Otherwise, who the hell I am to raise objection on any post. Respected powdernose is there to glare and admonish. And he never spares.

To be honest, after reading respected and dearest powdernose and Joe's posts, I went through the whole thread. Then your post was there. I had really missed some very important points that you people mentioned.

My last post is all about my concern the discussion keep continuing. Anyone might not become silent.

To be honest, Kynam's being a cultivated one as well is shocking for me. Otherwise, in 2017, first I stood up and became attentive first, and uttered the word 'Kynam'. Hype. Marketing! In 2018, when I found Kynam is available quite easily, but at a high price, I kept sitting when pronouncing Kynam. And by the end of 2018, and till the last three months, the Kynam oils turned into some unknown profile, and Kynam got distempered in white, black, green, and I think yellow Kynam as well. Evolution!

Now it is cultivated. Wow! GCMS is needed to authenticate its being genuine. I think none has raised objection on Alex' words about Kynam cultivated. If some queries are, they are about the GCMS of the wood respected Alex possessed.



Edit: Correction made

thank you dear I totally feel you and It's the case with many friend and clients who I was very sad to tell them that all kinam in the market is cultivated, it's not bad or fake as some may think cultivated means low quality it's not, I have been in those kinam farms and I have seen the process, I have bought and sold and I have burned and tasted the wood and it is beautiful and precious, but the fact is it's not wild.
unfortunately I have seen companies and sellers who offer this kind of wood (cultivated kinam) as wild some really don't know it and some do know it but knows that the customer don't know it so say it's wild but it's not that is the truth and I have seen it many times. this doesn't mean we can enjoy or be happy about the one in the market as I have explained the one that is 5 years and above is very high quality and it really takes lots of knowledge and work to cultivate it. I got the wood we had personally from a kinam farm the people there very nice and friendly and many of them are just farmers not business men so they sell it to vendors and from there it switches hands few times and finally when it reached the customers it's a multiplication of the price. I'm not saying anything that we done anything special, or came with a new invention all we done is made a test on a 5 years old cultivated kinam wood that we think after few test it one of the best cultivated kinds in the market and we published the test and the results. anyone with some effort and will can do that I hope more companies and vendors will do this.
best regards

 

[Alex]

You made the claim THERE IS NO WILD KINAM. The onus of proof is on you.
If you say there is nobody selling wild kinam that still does not prove there is no wild kinam.
Only that there is not any for sale that you know of.

dear how you prove the existence of something that you are making the clam that it doesn't exist, logical debates don't work this way dear.
if you say flying unicorns doesn't exist, I can't say you have to prove that flying unicorn doesn't exist, I even bring you a flying unicorn, show you one in real life, or bring you an evidence that there is a flying unicorn.
I'm saying what I'm saying with our 10 years or more experience in woods and specifically kinam, selling, buying and being consulted to check, find, and rate kinam, working hand to hand with kinam farmers and collectors and this is a fact to me. not saying that there is not a possibility that some royalty or kind somewhere in the world do have an ancient piece of kinam, not sating that somewhere under the deep jungles or mountains of Vietnamese there is no tree that dose has some very little wild kinam. I'm simply saying what is being sold and bought in the market is all cultivated. so in other words I'm not saying there is no flying unicorns I'm just saying that they don't exist nowadays.
regards to you

 

[Alex]

https://www.ebay.com.au/i/254213917449?ul_noapp=true
this is the same people who are farming and selling "plantation kinam"
and most likely where you get your "kinam" from.

I'm not sure by who you mean "same people" as I have mentioned all kinam in the market is cultivated so I guess this makes them one of the people farming and selling cultivated kinam.
it is possible that it's the same or similar farm (with the difference that the lab test and piece we tested which is listed is called white and this is called green ours is Vietnamese and this Chinese, our is whole and this is broken which I'm sure you noticed but as I have previously explained and mentioned there are about 3 major kinam farms in Vietnam and that is where 90% of the kinam in the market is coming from (including the kinam that we tested, sold, listed or selling) so you could be very right.
but I assure you that we didn't get our kinam or any of our products for that matter from eBay or any other website

 

[Woodland Note]

I don't like joining any dramas, but what I can't wrap my mind around is that 5 years old cultivated tree wood sells for $500 dollars per 1 gram...

 

[amanitamusc]

dear how you prove the existence of something that you are making the clam that it doesn't exist, logical debates don't work this way dear.
if you say flying unicorns doesn't exist, I can't say you have to prove that flying unicorn doesn't exist, I even bring you a flying unicorn, show you one in real life, or bring you an evidence that there is a flying unicorn.
I'm saying what I'm saying with our 10 years or more experience in woods and specifically kinam, selling, buying and being consulted to check, find, and rate kinam, working hand to hand with kinam farmers and collectors and this is a fact to me. not saying that there is not a possibility that some royalty or kind somewhere in the world do have an ancient piece of kinam, not sating that somewhere under the deep jungles or mountains of Vietnamese there is no tree that dose has some very little wild kinam. I'm simply saying what is being sold and bought in the market is all cultivated. so in other words I'm not saying there is no flying unicorns I'm just saying that they don't exist nowadays.
regards to you

Ok so we agree that we should stop with the inane statements.Very good.

 

[amanitamusc]

I don't like joining any dramas, but what I can't wrap my mind around is that 5 years old cultivated tree wood sells for $500 dollars per 1 gram...

I'm not sure by who you mean "same people" as I have mentioned all kinam in the market is cultivated so I guess this makes them one of the people farming and selling cultivated kinam.
it is possible that it's the same or similar farm (with the difference that the lab test and piece we tested which is listed is called white and this is called green ours is Vietnamese and this Chinese, our is whole and this is broken which I'm sure you noticed but as I have previously explained and mentioned there are about 3 major kinam farms in Vietnam and that is where 90% of the kinam in the market is coming from (including the kinam that we tested, sold, listed or selling) so you could be very right.
but I assure you that we didn't get our kinam or any of our products for that matter from eBay or any other website

You did sell some kinam from China on your site.

 

[amanitamusc]

I'm not sure by who you mean "same people" as I have mentioned all kinam in the market is cultivated so I guess this makes them one of the people farming and selling cultivated kinam.
it is possible that it's the same or similar farm (with the difference that the lab test and piece we tested which is listed is called white and this is called green ours is Vietnamese and this Chinese, our is whole and this is broken which I'm sure you noticed but as I have previously explained and mentioned there are about 3 major kinam farms in Vietnam and that is where 90% of the kinam in the market is coming from (including the kinam that we tested, sold, listed or selling) so you could be very right.
but I assure you that we didn't get our kinam or any of our products for that matter from eBay or any other website

Corrections #1 Kevin is selling wild Kinam as listed.#2This is from Vietnam as listed.#3 You can buy from Kevin directly obviating ebay or any website.#4The kinam on your site is listed as white red soil.
What exactly is red white soil plantation kinam?

 

[Joe King]

I guess this makes them one of the people farming and selling cultivated kinam.
it is possible that it's the same or similar farm (……..) so you could be very right.
but I assure you that we didn't get our kinam or any of our products for that matter from eBay or any other website

I was not suggesting you buy your wood from ebay. Interesting that you are not sure where your wood came from. Also you admit you may be buying from someone who also sells the impossible wild kinam which means you either don't trust the people you buy from or you are misleading people.

 

[VPhong]

- OMG dear the lab test that I published has our company name and logo on it, my profile that I made every post from has our company name and logo, my user name is "the perfumist" which is our comapny name, I have clearly mentioned in the majority of post "our company" " the perfumist" "Ali Attar" I'm really not sure from where or why you got the feeling that we are a non profit company. we are a perfume house a company and not a non profit organization with that been said I don't think this prevent, stop, or shame us or any other company or house for that matter from publishing scientific facts and authentic lab report, educating others and spreading knowledge and awarness actually that is what are trying to do, (rather than promoting or offering what some may sell or present as wild kinam) we are listing our test, saying the truth and opening the door with a very warm and friendly invitation to all other sellers, companies and housed to be more scientific and real and present their work, findings and lab tests. I don't think there is anything showy or bad about that.

These are references from your posts –

“ … there is nothing to market dear we are not collaborated or associated with any company farm or vendor we are not advertising a site that sell or promote kinam”, Alex Post #154

“I would say get a high quality "cultivated kinam" 5 years or more, try it and smell it and enjoy it rather than just arguing and talking about wild and ancient kinam without having a clue how it smells or what it is like to burn it on a slow low heat electrical burner with a cup of Chinese tea or some real good coffee”, Alex Post #122

It was actually always clear to me that your company cares greatly for profit from your hard work here, despite a part of me wanting to give you a chance. The above references only support my impression that your presence here is a guise to lure people into buying cultivated kinam from your company. It is rather convenient that you chose the logo “the Perfumist” as your profile picture making each of your post an advertisement here for your company. This is in addition to dropping hints and indicators as to which company we should thank for all this wonderful lab work and research on the "Wild Kinam SCAM" and redirect ourselves to the genuine and considerably cheaper “Cultivated Kinam”

… AND TO REITERATE @Joe King ’s DISCOVERY - “THE PERFUMIST WEBSITE HAS THIS FOR SALE!”.
WE ALL CAN CONVENIENTLY BUY CULTIVATED KINAM FROM YOUR WEBSITE

-------- I THINK NOT!!! ----------​

 

[Woodland Note]

I have an idea... Dear Alex, if you have true kinam/kyara in an unlimited amount from a plantation, and you can afford an expensive test like you have mentioned before then... How about sending 1 gram samples of this material for the smell test to trustworthy old-timer noses who are oud experts and familiar with the subject? People like Taha from AgarAura, Ensar from EnsarOud, KyaraZen, Nadeem (ouddict), come to my mind. If they were able to confirm this cultivated kinam is as good as wild ancient one, I would believe it, and I’ll bet many other people would too. The opinion of such authorities would matter to me more than any kinam lab test from any university in the world...