MFH - Experiments & Materials

[MaxFromHolland]

There we go, myrrh top 15% fraction.
View attachment 55422

Well, the first attempt to re-create the original scent reminds me of childhood breakfast at my grandmothers place..

Not quite the intended church scent 😬 but i better write it down just in case.. (scent emerged from the double baked bread when soaked in the tea. Which was tricky because the bread is very light and airy and you could only soak it for less than a second before it would fall apart)

Machine is still running the testblend while i write this. In a weird way its a comforting scent.

Category happy accidents🙂

 

[MaxFromHolland]

doodbeest is a glorious looking word. I've almost considered making something called jujube jojoba (looks better on paper than pronounced sadly), and nonsensical with no use, because it looks silly.

Haha fragrance names based on how the letters look together must be a novel trend 🙂

(It should read 'dood beest' (dead animal) but didn't bother with a space) Once they spill a drip on the outside of the bottle there will be no further need for a label anyway 😷

 

[roflwaffle]

Haha fragrance names based on how the letters look together must be a novel trend 🙂

(It should read 'dood beest' (dead animal) but didn't bother with a space) Once they spill a drip on the outside of the bottle there will be no further need for a label anyway 😷

That's almost better
dood
beest
is so very aesthetically pleasing all the same. Though, rotboombast is also similarly pleasing, at least pronounced in 'murican, though maybe dutch terms just have a more pleasing look to them in general. And, maybe not a trend, but sometimes little things are delightful in their own right and add volumes.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Pretty much ended up with nutmeg and cardamom in amyris 😬 and only a faint hint of the other notes.
I'll put it aside for a while, would not be the first bottle that comes alive after a few weeks. But its not very promising..

They other day i tried to distill peat, Vietnamese coffee, nutmeg and cardamom. It's been sitting on the wait and see shelf, as it didn't smell as expected. While the hydrosol had all the expected notes, the oil still is pretty horrible, even though some heavier notes start to develop. I'll keep the bottle, if only out of curiosity how it changes over time.
But i also started a tincture, same recipe but smaller amounts when i noticed that peat and coffee were missing in the distilled version. Stirrer cant handle such large bottle with muddy contents, so have to manual shake 3-4 times a day and be patient. Should be ready to process in a few days time..

 

[MaxFromHolland]

the oil still is pretty horrible, even though some heavier notes start to develop.

During drydown, there is a brief moment between topnotes and amyris base where i get the smokyness of the peat and some faint earth and chocolate. Apart from the tincture mentioned above i will probably focus of the peat for a while..

 

[roflwaffle]

Are you distilling the peat directly? I found that the peat carries through distillation extensively by burning the peat to smoke, well in my case wetted grains prior to fermentation/distillation. But if you're not getting results with peat itself, try smoking wet herbs or other green matter so it'll collect it. The smoke I believe is key. If you're getting strong peat from peat directly, nevermind me. The peat via smoking then distilled is... prominent.. strong, lingering.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Are you distilling the peat directly? I found that the peat carries through distillation extensively by burning the peat to smoke, well in my case wetted grains prior to fermentation/distillation. But if you're not getting results with peat itself, try smoking wet herbs or other green matter so it'll collect it. The smoke I believe is key. If you're getting strong peat from peat directly, nevermind me. The peat via smoking then distilled is... prominent.. strong, lingering.

Tnx, i will try that if i dont get anywhere with the plain raw stuff.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

They other day i tried to distill peat, Vietnamese coffee, nutmeg and cardamom. It's been sitting on the wait and see shelf, as it didn't smell as expected. While the hydrosol had all the expected notes, the oil still is pretty horrible, even though some heavier notes start to develop. I'll keep the bottle, if only out of curiosity how it changes over time.
But i also started a tincture, same recipe but smaller amounts when i noticed that peat and coffee were missing in the distilled version. Stirrer cant handle such large bottle with muddy contents, so have to manual shake 3-4 times a day and be patient. Should be ready to process in a few days time..
View attachment 55542

Filtration day.
Seems a lot more promising, smelled coffee, chocolate, earth, smoke and citrus.
Second thoughts about using amyris as carrier again, think i want something dryer*.
Tomorrow i'll do the first pass and concentrate it down to 100 ml and take it from there.

*Clueless as what that would be, amateur after all 🙂

 

[Mr.P]

Filtration day.
Seems a lot more promising, smelled coffee, chocolate, earth, smoke and citrus.
Second thoughts about using amyris as carrier again, think i want something dryer*.
Tomorrow i'll do the first pass and concentrate it down to 100 ml and take it from there.

*Clueless as what that would be, amateur after all 🙂

if you could find a relatively inexpensive authentic sandalwood, the plantation oils are so mild that they seem like they could be a good carrier (for anything that smells good with the fixative / suppressive effects).

Copaiba balsam (exudate) or oil has a mild green stem aroma and it's mostly beta-caryophyllene i believe.

Gurjun balsam is another mild one with its own particular nuance. I almost feel like each of these would be appropriate for a different context. Perhaps copaiba for herbal and floral, gurjun for woods, roots, etc., amyris for something else...

 

[Mr.P]

i've also smelled some very inexpensive and extremely mild/neutral smelling kinam co2 oils. Not the dull thick stuffy ones but things that were literally just like a neutral / mild carrier with a light floral woodiness.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

i've also smelled some very inexpensive and extremely mild/neutral smelling kinam co2 oils. Not the dull thick stuffy ones but things that were literally just like a neutral / mild carrier with a light floral woodiness.

Thanks for the suggestions.
Just occurred to be it may be smart to first pull a small amount from the bulk and evaporate that with 1ml jojoba so i can swipe and study it.

I don't know the scent of gurjun balm yet, probably should source some as i see it mentioned more often and descriptions suggest its interesting.

 

[roflwaffle]

Cabreuva may be another more neutral option (it's been on my list, but I've not tried it yet)

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Filtration day.
Seems a lot more promising, smelled coffee, chocolate, earth, smoke and citrus.
Second thoughts about using amyris as carrier again, think i want something dryer*.
Tomorrow i'll do the first pass and concentrate it down to 100 ml and take it from there.

*Clueless as what that would be, amateur after all 🙂

Decided to use the distilled oil as carrier for the extract because they seemed to complement each other, layering both on my skin.
There's still some alcohol left in the jar, but i already like it a lot and i feel actually a bit reluctant to put it in the vacuumchamber again..
It's by far the most complex and rich scent i managed to create 🙂 and if it wasn't so thin that it is barely swipe-able i would not tinker with it any further..
Anyway, letting this settle for a bit, gives me time to contemplate a next step.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

View attachment 55609
Decided to use the distilled oil as carrier for the extract because they seemed to complement each other, layering both on my skin.
There's still some alcohol left in the jar, but i already like it a lot and i feel actually a bit reluctant to put it in the vacuumchamber again..
It's by far the most complex and rich scent i managed to create 🙂 and if it wasn't so thin that it is barely swipe-able i would not tinker with it any further..
Anyway, letting this settle for a bit, gives me time to contemplate a next step.

Nope.. Did a small test and cant remove the alcohol. With it, the magic disappears. Guess i just made my first alcohol based fragrance then 🙂

Open: a camphorous, somewhat medicinal blast that is followed by smoky, earthy roast coffee. After a while, sweeter whiffs of chocolate begin to appear. Only for that roasted earth scent to return, like walking around someplace. Further down the road the smoke begins to fade, causing the earthy coffee to morph into a raw, moist but sweet wood. Then, after about 4 hours, just the memory remains 🙂

 

[Mr.P]

Nope.. Did a small test and cant remove the alcohol. With it, the magic disappears. Guess i just made my first alcohol based fragrance then 🙂

Open: a camphorous, somewhat medicinal blast that is followed by smoky, earthy roast coffee. After a while, sweeter whiffs of chocolate begin to appear. Only for that roasted earth scent to return, like walking around someplace. Further down the road the smoke begins to fade, causing the earthy coffee to morph into a raw, moist but sweet wood. Then, after about 4 hours, just the memory remains 🙂

that sounds excellent!

When it comes to any kind of mixed perfume or attar, I greatly prefer gentle, natural smelling fragrances that have restrained silage and do not "stain" the skin for long periods of time with particular aromas.

Not that I don't like long lasting scents but no way am I turning over 12 hours of my day to a mixed perfume. That's reserved for natural materials on their own or for testing my own concoctions repeatedly throughout a day.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

that sounds excellent!

When it comes to any kind of mixed perfume or attar, I greatly prefer gentle, natural smelling fragrances that have restrained silage and do not "stain" the skin for long periods of time with particular aromas.

Not that I don't like long lasting scents but no way am I turning over 12 hours of my day to a mixed perfume. That's reserved for natural materials on their own or for testing my own concoctions repeatedly throughout a day.

Yes, to me 4 hrs is a long enough journey.

I was quite surprised, losing topnotes so quickly in the vacuumchamber. I dont usually work with such light stuff like alpha and beta pinene or 1,8 cineole. But that's result of wrong order of things. Should have reduced the extract seperately and then add the distillate 'post vacuumchamber'. Trying to use the latter as carrier puts me in the spot where i can no longer sep the alcohol from the volatiles with nearly same boilingpoint under vacuum.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Yes, to me 4 hrs is a long enough journey.

I was quite surprised, losing topnotes so quickly in the vacuumchamber. I dont usually work with such light stuff like alpha and beta pinene or 1,8 cineole. But that's result of wrong order of things. Should have reduced the extract seperately and then add the distillate 'post vacuumchamber'. Trying to use the latter as carrier puts me in the spot where i can no longer sep the alcohol from the volatiles with nearly same boilingpoint under vacuum.

I put some in a bottle with atomizer and that works reasonably well. It has a bit less of that initial blast effect compared with swiping which might be due to swiping the stuff in my beard while im not in for spraying the stuff in my face🙂

Being (said to be) a controlfreak i was thinking how to go about creating this scent in a more controlled manner*. It seems i need a distillate of the cardamom and nutmeg because with extraction i get stuck removing the volatiles with the alcohol.
But i need an extract of the peat and coffee because distillation takes forever and still doesn't pull the scent out the way extraction does.
So the plan is to extract, replace the alcohol with amyris and put that in the receiver to collect the cardamom and nutmeg.
Thats just a 1-hour run at a modest flowrate.
Worst case i get the scent but that initial blast is suppressed by the fixative properties of the oil. It that case i could use the oil to make another alcohol based fragrance, i think.....

* Bit anxious perhaps after not being able to re-create a myrrh/frankincense blend that i liked a lot.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Made a small modification to return the hydrosol to the still below the steamrack, instead of having it drip down from the column, landing on the botanicals - which wasn't very elegant.
It also allowed me to make that column 20% shorter.
Ofcourse a mod demands testing 🙂 thus steam distilling my beloved pine bark into frankincense/ amyris. Runtime 50 hrs @ 0,36 kg/hr steam.

 

[Mr.P]

Made a small modification to return the hydrosol to the still below the steamrack, instead of having it drip down from the column, landing on the botanicals - which wasn't very elegant.
It also allowed me to make that column 20% shorter.
Ofcourse a mod demands testing 🙂 thus steam distilling my beloved pine bark into frankincense/ amyris. Runtime 50 hrs @ 0,36 kg/hr steam.
View attachment 55661

excellent, I appreciate you sharing your progress here. Looks like you're getting things dialed in…

 

[MaxFromHolland]

excellent, I appreciate you sharing your progress here. Looks like you're getting things dialed in…

One thing i would like to add is a small botanicals basket that i can snap on the inside of the lid to steam distill small amounts. I do have the small basket that began its life as part of a mashed potato press 🙂 but haven't quite figured the snap part out.. Else some metal jar with screwcap would do the trick after drilling holes in the bottom + a large one in the cap. Category somehow&someday.