MFH - Experiments & Materials

[Mr.P]

My deadline 'tour de force' is done, rewarding myself with a few days off 2nd half of next week. Will run the distillation then 🙂

keep us updated. i've been too busy with these kittens and now rabbits… But it's multiflora rose and elderflower season here. I would like to distill some elder flower over alcohol. I did the same with the multiflora rose a few few years ago (triple infused) and I still have plenty of that left over but I would like to make another batch… Going to have to move fast because it's a short season.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

keep us updated. i've been too busy with these kittens and now rabbits… But it's multiflora rose and elderflower season here. I would like to distill some elder flower over alcohol. I did the same with the multiflora rose a few few years ago (triple infused) and I still have plenty of that left over but I would like to make another batch… Going to have to move fast because it's a short season.

Elderflower must be great too. Got one in my garden and love the scent.
Hope them bunnies allow you some time..

 

[MaxFromHolland]

In case you're curious, the recipe (formula) will probably be:

500 gr dried turf (peat), schred
380 gr culi coffee, coarse ground
100 gr nutmeg, crushed
20 gr cardamom, crushed
In the receiver:
35 ml Amyris
Technique: hydrodistillation
Steamflow: 0,09 kg/hr
Runtime: 72 hrs

I did away with the idea of soaking.

Started a day early with a few tweaks:
The turf is not sold dried and with its 40% moisture, the 500 gr dry weight translates to 833 gr which i rounded to 1 kilo because its scent is milder than i expected.
The cardamom is also a bit milder than expected so i went for 35 gr (dried pods).
Coffee and nutmeg are as expected and unchanged.
Btw i didn't crush the cardamom but just cut the pods open. Another Zen moment it was. Theres quite a few of 'em in 35 gr 🙂

Steamflow is low at 0,09 kg/hr and i use same setting for the heating up phase, which will take about 4-5 hrs, i think thats a good thing.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Started a day early with a few tweaks:
The turf is not sold dried and with its 40% moisture, the 500 gr dry weight translates to 833 gr which i rounded to 1 kilo because its scent is milder than i expected.
The cardamom is also a bit milder than expected so i went for 35 gr (dried pods).
Coffee and nutmeg are as expected and unchanged.
Btw i didn't crush the cardamom but just cut the pods open. Another Zen moment it was. Theres quite a few of 'em in 35 gr 🙂

Steamflow is low at 0,09 kg/hr and i use same setting for the heating up phase, which will take about 4-5 hrs, i think thats a good thing.

Fun color this new Amyris has. The kind I bought before was almost clear.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

View attachment 55216
Fun color this new Amyris has. The kind I bought before was almost clear.

Just catched a few drips of hydrosol on my hand, after 22 hrs there is mainly the scent of peat and some of the coffee notes. So the light notes from the nutmeg and cardamom are trapped in the amyris which is where they should stay. The amount of oil in the receiver has increased by 5ml which is pretty much all of the topnotes.

Every drip of hydrosol from the condensator is slowly sinking trough the oil layer*, leaving some molecules behind. So now it's just a waiting game until the scent of the hydrosol starts to fade, or until it begins to develop an off-note, whatever comes first..

* I put a tube in the bottom part of the condenser that ends just above oil. This way the condensate drips on the oil with little momentum, allowing for that slow sinking trough the oil layer.
Meanwhile i bought a glassware insert instead, that can be put between condenser and receiver. That's nice for future runs.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Added CO2 redistillation to my distillation model. Guess such cleaning up would result in something similar to an absolue, with a richer profile than an essential oil.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Added CO2 redistillation to my distillation model. Guess such cleaning up would result in something similar to an absolue, with a richer profile than an essential oil.
View attachment 55239

Added vacuumdistillation to the model. Now, under Steamflow I can set the reduced pressure and the thing calculates the new boilingpoint and setting for the hotplate. (The static loss drops with lower boilingpoint so less energy is needed.

Not that I get to benefit from it, my ex-pressurecooker-still is airtight under pressure as the sicilone ring is pushed in the gap between pot and lid by the pressure, but that sealing trick doesn't work when you pull some vacuum🙁
Also, with reduced pressure, the steam expands (a lot) more, causing a much faster flow which demands for equally higher performance of the condensor, so it's not as easy as hooking up a small pump + bleedervalve and be done..

Anyways, 2 screenshots one @ 1013 and one @ 500 mbar.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Just catched a few drips of hydrosol on my hand, after 22 hrs there is mainly the scent of peat and some of the coffee notes. So the light notes from the nutmeg and cardamom are trapped in the amyris which is where they should stay. The amount of oil in the receiver has increased by 5ml which is pretty much all of the topnotes.

Every drip of hydrosol from the condensator is slowly sinking trough the oil layer*, leaving some molecules behind. So now it's just a waiting game until the scent of the hydrosol starts to fade, or until it begins to develop an off-note, whatever comes first..

* I put a tube in the bottom part of the condenser that ends just above oil. This way the condensate drips on the oil with little momentum, allowing for that slow sinking trough the oil layer.
View attachment 55238Meanwhile i bought a glassware insert instead, that can be put between condenser and receiver. That's nice for future runs.

Pretty much ended up with nutmeg and cardamom in amyris 😬 and only a faint hint of the other notes.
I'll put it aside for a while, would not be the first bottle that comes alive after a few weeks. But its not very promising..

 

[MaxFromHolland]

In need of the scent of rotting wood for a project, I figured I can use my rotting bark tincture. But while putting it in the vacuumchamber to concentrate and replace the alcohol for a carrier I was surprised how much the scent resembles oak moss. So it remains to be seen whether I can use it or end up with some poor mans oak moss..

 

[Mr.P]

Are you looking for the forest floor type wood decay or an anaerobic / swampy type?

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Are you looking for the forest floor type wood decay or an anaerobic / swampy type?

Something like that old garden shed which is leaky, moist and rotting away. Think its a mix of earthy, moist wood and fungal notes.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

In need of the scent of rotting wood for a project, I figured I can use my rotting bark tincture. But while putting it in the vacuumchamber to concentrate and replace the alcohol for a carrier I was surprised how much the scent resembles oak moss. So it remains to be seen whether I can use it or end up with some poor mans oak moss..

Haven't continued today except for putting mud + oil on a stirrer 🙂
Need to work from home tomorrow as work is closed due to a code red weather alert, so plenty of time..
Used the opportunity to replace the -18° frozen water in the coldtrap for a natrium solution. If water starts to melt its 0° immediately. The solution should melt while staying around -15° flattening out the efficiency that way.
Went from 1 liter to 30 ml in 2hrs yesterday. Irritating enough 30ml to zero can easily take twice that long (due to pressence of oil). Otoh, dont really care about losing 30ml ethanol to the vacuumpump's watertank. Nice test for the ice though.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

I cant put the still in a water bath, but i found some metal grid on small legs in a thriftstore that i can put in the still and do the double boiler thing by putting a extra container inside. Something shallow and wide, i guess. Just need to watch it carefully then and measure the yield, because i can't calculate the runtime if part of the steam comes from the container with myrrh and part from around the container without myrrh. Aw, my inner-nerd hurts 🙂

Right. Yet another bright idea that doesn't work.
Why not? The water in the still boils and that makes it exactly 100°.
That heat has to be transferred to the inner bowl which starts to evaporate (the water, not the bowl😁).
Evaporation costs energy and that is supplied by the boiling water outside.
A balance occurs at 99,?° so the inner bowl never boils. And myrrh is waaay to heavy to travel with the vapor at 99.?°.

Live and learn they say.. ✅

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Haven't continued today except for putting mud + oil on a stirrer 🙂
Need to work from home tomorrow as work is closed due to a code red weather alert, so plenty of time..
Used the opportunity to replace the -18° frozen water in the coldtrap for a natrium solution. If water starts to melt its 0° immediately. The solution should melt while staying around -15° flattening out the efficiency that way.
Went from 1 liter to 30 ml in 2hrs yesterday. Irritating enough 30ml to zero can easily take twice that long (due to pressence of oil). Otoh, dont really care about losing 30ml ethanol to the vacuumpump's watertank. Nice test for the ice though.

Yay I'm done and satisfied.

Right to left:
Fresh hay - i simply dilluted some hay absolue with ipm
Ground coffee beans - ethanol extract, my jojoba thing, dilluted with ipm
Rotting wood - ethanol extr of rotting bark, jojoba thing, added some liquid-liquid extract of (boiled) mud and a drop of java vetiver
Cacao - cacao husks distilled into patchouli (smells a bit luxury for 'chocolate')
Dead animal - ethanol extr of dried cow lung (dog treats), jojoba thing and not dilluted to let 'em kids eww! bigtime 🙂

 

[Mr.P]

Yay I'm done and satisfied.
View attachment 55404
Right to left:
Fresh hay - i simply dilluted some hay absolue with ipm
Ground coffee beans - ethanol extract, my jojoba thing, dilluted with ipm
Rotting wood - ethanol extr of rotting bark, jojoba thing, added some liquid-liquid extract of (boiled) mud and a drop of java vetiver
Cacao - cacao husks distilled into patchouli (smells a bit luxury for 'chocolate')
Dead animal - ethanol extr of dried cow lung (dog treats), jojoba thing and not dilluted to let 'em kids eww! bigtime 🙂

You are definitely exploring some new territory here, nice to see what you're up to.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

You are definitely exploring some new territory here, nice to see what you're up to.

It's for a summer project with a performance and various activities.
Supplier didn't have much in stock and they were obviously late to order and got stuck. I noticed i could take care of some missing pieces with my own stock, so there's that.

Creating something that feels like a dead rat, broken bones included is more in line with my job 🙂

 

[MaxFromHolland]

Right. Yet another bright idea that doesn't work.
Why not? The water in the still boils and that makes it exactly 100°.
That heat has to be transferred to the inner bowl which starts to evaporate (the water, not the bowl😁).
Evaporation costs energy and that is supplied by the boiling water outside.
A balance occurs at 99,?° so the inner bowl never boils. And myrrh is waaay to heavy to travel with the vapor at 99.?°.

Live and learn they say.. ✅

There we go, myrrh top 15% fraction.

 

[Mr.P]

There we go, myrrh top 15% fraction.
View attachment 55422

how was this made? Is this a distilled myrrh oil and this is the first 15% to come through the still? Sorry if I missed an explanation upstream here

 

[MaxFromHolland]

how was this made? Is this a distilled myrrh oil and this is the first 15% to come through the still? Sorry if I missed an explanation upstream here

I did some distillation experiment a while back and had a few ml partial distilled cheap myrrh eo as leftover afterwards. At some point mixed it with frankincense and solvent for my roomscent machine. Loved it.
Then tried to recreate the scent using myrrh resinoid and another eo but didn't get that very same scent.
Then figured it may have something to do with the myrrh being a top fraction? More mobile, lighter molecules, i dont know..
So i found myself needing more top fraction to test that thesis, bought the exact same dirt cheap oil and put in in the still with water..
First tried some double boiler trick to keep the still clean which didnt work as usual😬 then just tossed it in reciting Latin phrases (everything steaming hot) and spent some quality time cleaning afterwards, oh well 🙂

 

[roflwaffle]

Yay I'm done and satisfied.
View attachment 55404
Right to left:
Fresh hay - i simply dilluted some hay absolue with ipm
Ground coffee beans - ethanol extract, my jojoba thing, dilluted with ipm
Rotting wood - ethanol extr of rotting bark, jojoba thing, added some liquid-liquid extract of (boiled) mud and a drop of java vetiver
Cacao - cacao husks distilled into patchouli (smells a bit luxury for 'chocolate')
Dead animal - ethanol extr of dried cow lung (dog treats), jojoba thing and not dilluted to let 'em kids eww! bigtime 🙂

doodbeest is a glorious looking word. I've almost considered making something called jujube jojoba (looks better on paper than pronounced sadly), and nonsensical with no use, because it looks silly.