Oud Distillation

[Jimmie Taylor]

@Al Shareef Oudh
@Faizal_p
@Alexander Oudh

Is there a difference that could be told, regarding the scent from the top, middle and bottom of the tree's wood-parts?

 

[Mr.P]

i think not, pearl. There are so many variables so poorly controlled or impossible to control, and the typical consumer is too far removed from the production and is unlikely to be able to sample enough oils with incontrovertible provenance. It's going to come down to trust - who do you feel has enough more experience than you and is likely to steer you the right way and not tell you stuff with only self-interest at heart. It is clear that folks are divided on this and unlikely to change their minds any time soon. I think ideally people with knowledge will be willing to share what they can (out of altruism, and not competitor bashing ideally) and we will have to decide what to believe.

Given the lack of unquestionable objectivity, I am inclined to listen to those who do not seem ruthlessly focused on self interest and who do not resort to extreme hyperbole to push their wares.

 

[Al Shareef Oudh]

@PEARL

Your post couldn't be more further from the truth and I really do not have the time to clarify your multiple errors, the facts speak for themselves and the readers will make up their mind.

 

[Ammar]

When two scholars argue with each other to personal level, there is nothing to add but confusion to the reader and the observer…

 

[F4R1d0uX]

When two scholars argue with each other to personal level, there is nothing to add but confusion to the reader and the observer…

I gave up from the begining, my english is too poor to understand this conversation without risking a big headache !

 

[Mr.P]

Ok - so there is always more to learn.

I am definitely lost at this point though. I have read this thread in too fragmented a way and don't feel like digging through it. What is the point you are debating again, with respect to oud and our knowledge of oud? Whether people should trust someone's nose or academic research, or both? Whether any claim should be taken with a grain of salt? Is this about the range of notes in distilled sinensis?

 

[Ammar]

@PEARL,
Agree…research paper or theory is in NOT the fact; it is an objective tool that might lead to the fact. That’s why I asked @Al Shareef Oudh what is his opinion based on experience implementing that if what he experienced does fit what the research paper concludes and he confirmed. This combo research + agreed experience is more valuable than only disagreed experience based on testing few patches for example. Does make the claim true? No it doesn’t although that is the best possible option we have at the moment, until being approved or proved otherwise again by the same tool, the research, which leads to build up knowledge based on multiple studies that lead to increase the power of statistical analysis towards or against the claimed theory. This is how the science machine is moving, although slowly yet steadily towards the right direction I believe.

 

[Mr.P]

Sounds reasonable to me, Pearl.

 

[Al Shareef Oudh]

Back to my topic...

The second important fact from this research of the Chinese A.Sinensis not having barn and rotten sock characteristics is the signature that was collated by running a series of GCMS tests to identify what Chinese A.Sinensis oil looks like. What would be interesting is to compare some of the chinese oils in the market against this foot print.

 

[Alexander Oudh]

@Al Shareef Oudh
@Faizal_p
@Alexander Oudh

Is there a difference that could be told, regarding the scent from the top, middle and bottom of the tree's wood-parts?

Where do I begin with this one? This is an absolutely great question that in my professional opinion has yet to be answered. I have not ever taken specific parts of a tree and distilled them separatly from other parts to see if there is a difference nor do I know anyone that has. Having said that, we all know that resin production/total content within a tree can never really be evaluated due to the lack of procedural testing methods. SO lets say you cut a tree into 3rds and distill each 1/3 independently of the others. I would assume that there would be an oil production difference (meaning one of the 3rds will produce more than the other 2/3rds). Now we have seen production differences when we distill wood from the same tree in different pots yet the smell is identical unless something contaminated the distillate. SO in short we can say that so far there may be no difference however this hasnt been independently verified, and I wouldnt expect this to be verified anytime soon unless someone is willing to fund a science project. But great question.

 

[Abdullah]

My upper hand is very sensitive, some ouds can be applied with no reaction, whereas others will cause contact dermatitis. So now I just swipe on my palm, but I always wash my hands first, I don't want the oud aroma to mix with any smell left on my hands from eating lunch, or handling metal coins, etc.

What bums me out is that sometimes I place a swipe of some special oud to cozy up to, then my mother-in-law starts cooking a meal with a strong smell like garlic and ginger. I just wasted some precious oud🙁

lollllllllllllllllllllllll!!!!! 😀😀😀😀😱😱😱😱

 

[Abdullah]

@PEARL @Al Shareef Oudh - i have just read the last few pages of this thread and reading both your posts was a pleasure

 

[Jimmie Taylor]

Where do I begin with this one? This is an absolutely great question that in my professional opinion has yet to be answered. I have not ever taken specific parts of a tree and distilled them separatly from other parts to see if there is a difference nor do I know anyone that has. Having said that, we all know that resin production/total content within a tree can never really be evaluated due to the lack of procedural testing methods. SO lets say you cut a tree into 3rds and distill each 1/3 independently of the others. I would assume that there would be an oil production difference (meaning one of the 3rds will produce more than the other 2/3rds). Now we have seen production differences when we distill wood from the same tree in different pots yet the smell is identical unless something contaminated the distillate. SO in short we can say that so far there may be no difference however this hasnt been independently verified, and I wouldnt expect this to be verified anytime soon unless someone is willing to fund a science project. But great question.

And what about the inner and outer layers (regarding the scent)? Oud Yusuf was distilled from shavings of the trunk and was very flowery.
Of course it was probably not soaked for too long and also it's a thai oud.
The inner layers look on pictures very dark and thick. Is it because the tree produces its resin from the inside to the outside?
Could it be that the outer layers are more like top notes and the inner layer 'more' like base-notes?

 

[Jimmie Taylor]

Could oud-trees could get accustomed to lower temperatures/climate zones (over a long period of time)?
I think it was done with other plants too.

 

[Habz786]

When i was new to Oud i had a misconception that the thicker the oil the better it is. I've also heard many others who aren't so much into Oud say this. We have heard of many great oils being called Thaqeel (thick) in texture, some of my favorite oils are of this genre. However what makes an oil thick if its done right? i don't mean by lamping or leaving it exposed to direct sunlight or microwaving it or any other shortcut methods. What i mean is how can you distill an oil which comes out into the collector thick? is it the technique? the type of wood? is there a secret behind this? I've also come across very runny oils almost like water on the flip-side what makes an oil so runny? Should Oud oils be so runny? Does oil have to have a certain texture and feel to it? Interested to hear thoughts..........

 

[jalil]

good question

 

[Abdullah]

When i was new to Oud i had a misconception that the thicker the oil the better it is. I've also heard many others who aren't so much into Oud say this. We have heard of many great oils being called Thaqeel (thick) in texture, some of my favorite oils are of this genre. However what makes an oil thick if its done right? i don't mean by lamping or leaving it exposed to direct sunlight or microwaving it or any other shortcut methods. What i mean is how can you distill an oil which comes out into the collector thick? is it the technique? the type of wood? is there a secret behind this? I've also come across very runny oils almost like water on the flip-side what makes an oil so runny? Should Oud oils be so runny? Does oil have to have a certain texture and feel to it? Interested to hear thoughts..........

maybe a combination of all of the above? i have also heard this from a lot of my friends who do not know much about oud.
fyi i dont think i can ever remember a hydro or steam distilled oil come out thaqeel thick fresh from distillation

 

[Abdullah]

maybe someone else can shed some light on it.

 

[AbasFrag]

When i was new to Oud i had a misconception that the thicker the oil the better it is. I've also heard many others who aren't so much into Oud say this. We have heard of many great oils being called Thaqeel (thick) in texture, some of my favorite oils are of this genre. However what makes an oil thick if its done right? i don't mean by lamping or leaving it exposed to direct sunlight or microwaving it or any other shortcut methods. What i mean is how can you distill an oil which comes out into the collector thick? is it the technique? the type of wood? is there a secret behind this? I've also come across very runny oils almost like water on the flip-side what makes an oil so runny? Should Oud oils be so runny? Does oil have to have a certain texture and feel to it? Interested to hear thoughts..........

If I have an oil that I really like but it's very runny. Can I "light" it to make it thicker? Does this affect the quality of the oil?

 

[m.arif]

If I have an oil that I really like but it's very runny. Can I "light" it to make it thicker? Does this affect the quality of the oil?

If by light you mean exposing it to sunlight and air, or using a lamp and expose it to air, it should become thicker. Some believe that doing so will make the oil lose aromatic compounds. Some disagree.