Miscellany of the day

[Kai Leon Art Perfumer]

I continue to struggle with oakmoss. On its own it is amazing especially the old stuff – wild, natural, brings woodlands to mind. Now I recognize that this merely reflects my own lack of skill and experience but from my perspective every time I add it to a fragrance the effect is the opposite: it makes it smell ordinary, manufactured, mainstream. I'm recognizing that oak moss in the context of other sweet smelling things (or at least oak moss related aroma chemicals) is such a common place thing to encounter that I have this Pavlovian association with ordinariness, and as a result I don't have any fragrances that I'm crazy about that involve this material and I always end up abandoning the experiments that use it.

I think I have to go in a direction that is different, keeping the oakmoss in the context of materials it's not traditionally combined with... make it the centerpoint instead of a fixative or something like that

The mighty Oakmoss is indeed challenging if not tricky (all the vicious safety regulations of IFRA aside) -
once upon a time it was one of the grandest and most impactful staples in the first half of the twentieth century Perfumery; it played a crucial, corner-stone role in the evolution of the 'Chypre' class of fragrances - both of masculine and feminine 'vectors' - and some say there is no Chypre without Oakmoss at all -
as it was THE star ingredient in the original 'Chypre' by Coty launched in 1909, and then in the legendary 'Mitsouko' by Guerlain launched a decade later on - with allegedly the highest % of Oakmoss in any grand perfume - to this day).
Also, while not originally a part of 'Fougere' accord, it was added to it about a hundred years ago as well, and then nearly instantly became a hugely popular hit worlwide, establishing a new vibe of classical 'Barbershop' scent - rich, robust, radiant and groomed masculinity - the urban 'Tarzan' of the scent, so to say - with the Oakmoss absolute as the roaring engine of that fragrance.
As the result, the highly desirable and fashionalble vibe eventually became ubiquitous and then pervasive - falling a victim of its own popular success - turned with the time into a total cliche - 'this old-fashioned cloying 'brown thing'.

On top of that: while the full - uncut, unrefined (IFRA non-compliant) Oakmoss absolute posseses a nearly-magical atmospheric power, all its lesser versions - the rectified (low Atranol and such), regulated essences - along with synthetic recreations made by the major aroma-chemical corporations - while imitating the general aromatic character of Oakmoss, totally lack in that elusive-pheromonal 'magic' the original 'real stuff' has - what adds to the obnoxious-flat tacky-dated experience of most of the mass-industrial Oakmoss fragrances of today.

Also - as humans always tend to overdo, distastefully, compositions with Oakmoss became ever richer and busier, reinforcing the old-fashioned clumsy, dense and overbearing vibe of it:
add to Oakmoss the heavy spices (Clove, Cinnamon...), heavy 'masculine' flowers like Carnation and Jasmine, some loud animalics like Civet, some heavy sweet earthiness of Vetiver, drench it in the ubiquitous Vanilla (of course) and Benzoin, add the 'Cologne' Top - of 'masculine' Rosemary with some Citruses (Lemony but also Orangy) - and voila! - you have a cheerful grandpaesque 'Monster of Vulgar Excess' - how's that as the name for a perfume? 🙂
Keep adding some more! - musks and Frankincense - so god forbid it won't be 'too thin or too light' - (insert my sarcastic tone here) -
and you end up with a genuine bomb of the old-timey 'Barbershop' assault.
But then - on top of it, make it synthetic (cheap) and let it run for half a century through every soap and shaving cream and aftershave and hair-gel and the long line of middle-class perfumes (like the very succesful in their sixties-seventies' heyday -
the 'upscale-hippie 'Aramis 900' or the simpler workplace-tolerable 'Faberge's Brut' or the posh-and-polished 'dandy' epitome of the rich Chypres - 'Habit Rouge' of Guerlain - and every other, lesser man-grooming concoction imaginable...

After good 70 years or so - of the immense popularity as The Man's Scent through the best part of the twentieth century, crowds - of both the perfumers and the consumers - eventually got tired of it - and the 'Barbershop' Fougere became 'the smell of grandpa' in the general society's mind. And then the IFRA cartel had arrived (the early seventies) and gradually set a systematic attack on Oakmoss, nearly outlawing and outphasing it - almost completely eliminating it from the fragrant modern palette, allowing only the bland and insipid, gutted and hollowed-out substitutes.

BUT - as everything is cyclical, Oakmoss - quietly, tacitly - is making a revisioned, re-edited return into the men's fragrances (not so yet in the feminine direction) - with re-imagined compositions like the artisan 'Evernia' by Jane Ormonde - a true ode for the Oakmoss fanatics (and there are some out there - despite all odds), or the less subtle more 'smoke in your face' 'Encens Chypre' by Sultan Pasha Attars.

The 'secret' to the use of Oakmoss - is the Editing - showing restrain and being cleverly selective about its companions - while avoiding the tiresome overused cliches (and there is nothing can be done over our collective memory of that 'Barbershop' assault - that still goes on in the lower-tier of mens'-grooming products despite a century of exposure - apparently, there is still a place for it on a trashy side of the global market).

There were many years that all I could is to smell the real Oakmoss absolute - from the bottle or on paper blot - just to appreciate it as it is - in all its richness yet honest singularity, but could not force myself to use it in the composing
- so strong was my aquired antipathy to the 'Oakmossed' fragrances.
I still feel repulsed by those classical Oakmoss chypres to this day (with all those generously added spices, 'suave' herbs like geraniums, rosemary and lavenders, carnations, more common animalics and other heavy companions),
But after 2 decades of contemplations, I find my ways with it -
- I use it (the real uncut Absolute) very sparingly as a 'magic spice' to the bitter-airy compositions - in the threshold amounts - as I respect its incredible power - both in the contribution to the character of the projection as well as to the tenacity of the fragrance;
- I avoid - like a plague - pairing it with spices and with anything even remotely sweet or fruity, not even with the lighter Neroli or herbal-sweet Lavender (once super-classical pairings);
- I use strongly contrasting and less common (in the context of pairing with Oakmoss) - yet distinctive and subliminally connecting essences as its companions - like Seaweed, Rose Pepper, Juniper, Elemi and Myrrh, Mitti and Onycha seashells' attars, Angelica and Costus roots, Katrafay and Sages, Marjoram and Hyssop, Olive leaf and Yarrow, Black Currant bud, Yuzu and Sudachi - Japanese citruses, non-gourmand Orris root resinoids and absolutes (or its earthy Germanica butter) and White Ambergris,
- and lastly - non-animalic and non-gourmand 'airy-aquatic' and bitter-mineralic Ouds - although the mighty Oakmoss not just competes with and overshadows them, but can easily 'swallow' them whole - if the dosage allows - which I see as a waste of the precious Ouds;
- I keep its compositions structurally very simple and conceptually clear, creating a vibe of a unified, single-mood 'Ambience' - like for example 'the Morning Forest Air' - avoiding 'rich salads' or multi-sided complexity of the 'kithcen-sink' Chypres entirely - as those will end up as those cloying, overbearing, dated vibes we regrettably grew tired of:
Editing is the key: 'LESS IS MORE' - always in the case of Oakmoss (for me today that is, maybe tomorrow I'll change my mind).

... I still have not managed to find the right composition to star Oakmoss as a main ingredient - for my taste that is - without going back again to the common cliches or to that dated vibe my aromatic memory still holds - since the early childhood' visits to the old barbershops - quite a few decades ago...

 

[Mr.P]

r

The mighty Oakmoss is indeed challenging if not tricky (all the vicious safety regulations of IFRA aside) -
once upon a time it was one of the grandest and most impactful staples in the first half of the twentieth century Perfumery; it played a crucial, corner-stone role in the evolution of the 'Chypre' class of fragrances - both of masculine and feminine 'vectors' - and some say there is no Chypre without Oakmoss at all -
as it was THE star ingredient in the original 'Chipre' by Coty launched in 1909, and then in the legendary 'Mitsouko' by Guerlain launched a decade later on - with allegedly the highest % of Oakmoss in any grand perfume - to this day).
Also, while not originally a part of 'Fougere' accord, it was added to it about a hundreds year ago as well, and then nearly instantly became a hugely popular hit worlwide, establing a new vibe of classical 'Barbershop' scent - rich, robust, radiant and groomed masculinity - the urban 'Tarzan' of the scent, so to say - with the Oakmoss absolute as the roaring engine of that fragrance.
As the result, the highly desirable and fashionalble vibe eventually became ubiquitous and then pervasive - falling a victim of its own popular success - turned with the time it into a total cliche - 'this old-fashioned cloying 'brown thing'.

On top of that: while the full - uncut, unrefined (IFRA non-compliant) Oakmoss absolute posseses a nearly-magical atmospheric power, all its lesser versions - the rectified (low Atranol and such), regulated essences - along with synthetic recreations made by the major aroma-chemical corporations - while imitating the general aromatic character of Oakmoss, totally lack in that elusive-pheromonal 'magic' the original 'real stuff' has - what adds to the obnoxious-flat tacky-dated experience of most of the Oakmoss fragrances today.

Also - as humans always tend to overdo, distastefully, compositions with Oakmoss became ever richer and busier, reinforcing the old-fashioned clumsy, dense and overbearing vibe of it:
add to Oakmoss the heavy spices (Clove, Cinnamon...), heavy 'masculine' flowers like Carnation and Jasmine, some loud animalics like Civet, some heavy sweet earthiness of Vetiver, drench it in the ubiquitous Vanilla (of course) or Benzoin, add the 'Cologne' Top - of 'masculine' Rosemary with some Citruses (Lemony but also Orangy) - and voila! - you have a cheerful grandpaesque 'Monster of Vulgar Excess' - how's that as the name for a perfume? 🙂
Keep adding some more! - musks and Frankincense - so god forbid it won't be 'too thin or too light' - (insert my sarcastic tone here) -
and you end up with a genuine bomb of the old-timey 'Barbershop' assault.
But then - on top of it, make it synthetic (cheap) and let it run for half a century through every soap and shaving cream and aftershave and hair-gel and the long line of middle-class perfumes (like the very succesful in their sixties-seventies' heyday -
the 'upscale-hippie 'Aramis 900' or the simpler workplace-tolerable 'Faberge's Brut' or the posh-and-polished 'dandy' epitome of the rich Chypres - 'Habit Rouge' of Guerlain - and every other, lesser man-grooming concoction imaginable...

After good 70 years or so - of the immense popularity as The Man's Scent through the best part of the twentieth century, crowds - of both the perfumers and the consumers - eventually got tired of it - and the 'Barbershop' Fougere became 'the smell of grandpa' in the general society's mind. And then the IFRA cartel had arrived (the early seventies) and gradually set a systematic attack on Oakmoss, nearly outlawing and outphasing it - almost completely eliminating it from the fragrant modern palette, allowing only the bland and insipid, gutted and hollowed-out substitutes.

BUT - as everything is cyclical, Oakmoss - quietly, tacitly - is making a revisioned, re-edited return into the men's fragrances (not so yet in the feminine direction) - with re-imagined compositions. - like the artisan 'Evernia' by Jane Ormonde - a true ode for the Oakmoss fanatics (and there are some out there - despite all odds), or the less subtle more 'smoke in your face' 'Encens Chypre' by Sultan Pahsa Attars.

The 'secret' to the use of Oakmoss - Editing - showing restrain and being cleverly selective about its companions - while avoiding the tiresome overused cliches (and there is nothing can be done over our collective memory of that 'Barbershop' assault - that still goes on in the lower-tier of mens'-grooming products despite a century of exposure - apparently there is a a place for it on a trashy side of the global market.

There were many years that all I could is to smell the real Oakmoss absolute - from the bottle or on paper blot - just to appreciate it as it is - in all its richness yet honest singularity, but could not force myself to use in the composing
- so strong was my aquired antipathy to the 'Oakmossed' fragrances.
I still feel repulsed by those classical Oakmoss chipres to this day (with all those generously added spices, 'suave' herbs like geraniums, rosemary and lavenders, carnations, more common animalics and other heavy companions),
But after 2 decades of contemplations, I find my ways with it -
- I use it (the real uncut Absolute) very sparingly as a 'magic spice' to the bitter-airy compositions - in the threshold amounts - as I respect its incredible power - both in the contribution to the character of the projection as well as to the tenacity of the fragrance;
- I avoid - like a plague - pairing it with spices and with anything even remotely sweet or fruity, not even with the lighter Neroli or herbal-sweet Lavender (once super-classical pairings);
- I use strongly contrasting and less common (in the context of pairing with Oakmoss) - yet distinctive and subliminally connecting essences as its companions - like Seaweed, Rose Pepper, Juniper, Elemi and Myrrh, Mitti and Onycha seashells' attars, Angelica and Costus roots, Katrafay and Sages, Marjoram and Hyssop, Olive leaf and Yarrow, Black Currant bud, Yuzu and Sudachi - Japanese citruses, non-gourmand Orris root resinoids and absolutes (or its earthy Germanica butter) and White Ambergris,
- and lastly - non-animalic and non-gourmand 'airy-aquatic' and bitter-mineralic Ouds - although the mighty Oakmoss not just competes with and overshadows them, but can easily 'swallow' them whole - if the dosage allows - which I see as a waste of the precious Ouds;
- I keep its compositions structurally very simple and conceptually clear, creating a vibe of a unified, single-mood 'Ambience' - like for example 'the Morning Forest Air' - avoiding 'rich salads' or multi-sided complexity of the 'kithcen-sink' Chypres entirely - as those will end up as those cloying, overbearing, dated vibes we regrettably grew tired of:
Editing is the key: 'LESS IS MORE' - always in the case of Oakmoss (for me today that is, maybe tomorrow I'll change my mind).

... I still have not managed to find the right composition to star Oakmoss as a main ingredient - for my taste that is - without going back again to the common cliches or to that dated vibe my aromatic memory still holds - since the early childhood' visits to the old barbershops - quite a few decades ago...

thanks for sharing such detailed thoughts. I was doing some simple layering experiments today with relatively dry materials - no florals or anything overly sweet. I was able to enjoy it in that context. There's something just amazing about the resinous dryness of my older absolute. I've actually never smelled any of the substitutes or fractionated extractions, I just have a handful of the potentially allergenic natural absolutes. One of these days I'd be curious to see what some of the new compliant materials are like but I'm not curious enough to actually order samples.

 

[Mr.P]

I like the Ventos natural patchoulol isolate so much I am now carrying a couple of grams with me in this mahogany inre (is that correct japanese?). This is the most suave patchouli - clean, woody, minty, almost has a slice of borneo oud aroma. delicious. The crystals are a little bit too large I need to pulverize this so it's a fine powder so it will stick to skin...

 

[Mr.P]

at the end of the day of tinkering, I have found that one of the finest lines out there is the line between the right amount and too much ambroxide isolate. Sometimes I get these little trace residues with the most delightful salty oceanic presence, but just a hair too much and it's veering off into the land of sugary cotton candy weird flat sweet laundry detergent. another one where concentration is everything and a high concentration is not simply more of a good thing, it is fundamentally a difference sensation. I haven't used this in any of my natural fragrances and I'm not sure that I ever would, but I love to experiment with it in layering experiments and sometimes it's just amazing.

 

[mobyus]

Ramadan Saffron

One of the lovely things about Ramadan is going to futoors (breakfast) and suhoors (late night munching) is sometimes there are giveaways at the end. This one had a Misk oil (not musk), 2 Dugga Maroke chips, and a vial of fresh saffron strands. I’m wondering what I can do with the saffron. I have like 90ml of sandalwood oil and other various ingredients. Thinking what I can do with it.

 

[Mr.P]

Ramadan Saffron

One of the lovely things about Ramadan is going to futoors (breakfast) and suhoors (late night munching) is sometimes there are giveaways at the end. This one had a Misk oil (not musk), 2 Dugga Maroke chips, and a vial of fresh saffron strands. I’m wondering what I can do with the saffron. I have like 90ml of sandalwood oil and other various ingredients. Thinking what I can do with it.

if you are patient you could make an infusion into the sandalwood. A pretty slow extraction but a wonderful combination. Best to grind or pulverize the threads first to make them more compact (even 10% weight of threads will take up a whole lot of space if not ground) and it will extract more quickly.

 

[Mr.P]

I just layered some l-muscone with some other oils. A very interesting aroma chemical that is a
chameleon - it smells quite different from itself depending on the environment and concentration. It can come across as soapy, and it can come across as an abstract modern white musk type aroma, but when it is layered just right it produces some truly incredible smooth addictive velvety musky accords - at the moment I have it layered in combination that includes patchouli and a few other things and it is producing what is to me a photorealistic japanese incense accord. I recognize there's so much variety in Japanese incense that that's almost a meaningless description but there are a number of different boxes of incense I've smelled that had this certain particular patchouly and musky richness and this could be the smell of one of those boxes.

when I first got this stuff I couldn't smell it at all. Now even at a very high dilutions it is quite intense. The soapy facet dominates when it's the most concentrated, the generic white musk sfent at moderate levels, and a beautiful natural smooth velvety musk comes only when quite dilute.

for anyone who hasn't heard of this, this is a synthesized copy of the most abundant / aromatic molecule found in actual musk. The "L-muscone" is refined to include just the left handed isomers (more closely resembles what's found in real musk). this makes it a little more expensive than regular muscone which includes both left and right handed isomers and is a little less true to the natural smell and material

Because this is a nature identical molecule it's biodegradable, etc. unlike some of the other synthetic musks.

 

[mobyus]

Oud Stories - Kashan Rose Oil

What can I say. It’s wonderful! Although I’m not at a point where I can discern various rose oils from each other. They all smell the same to me. Sparta, Taifi, Bulgare, and Kashan. Maybe potency plays a role. I’m sure trained noses know the difference.

 

[Olfactory Nomad]

Benzoin absolut that I forgot I had. So sweet. I got some on my fingers so wiped it through my hair. I've also swiped some vintage Ruh Khus - Alhindoud + a standard vetiver that I also forgot I had which is surprisingly good. It's been aging away in a draw.

 

[Mr.P]

oakmoss is such a trip. there are a relatively small number of super long skin scent materials and this is one of them. Sits right there along side labdanum, sandalwood, oud resin, vanillin and patchouli. These long lasting materials are precious and I wish I liked this one more in the context of perfume because I love it when it's all on its own. For whatever reason when I smell it in the dry down along with patchouli and labdanum, etc., it feels cheap to me. An association I have to get over.

 

[MaxFromHolland]

2 x oakmoss centered without barbershop 🙂
For the descriptions / inspiration 🙂

Mousse Illuminee

Olfactory profile: Aromatic | Mossy | Green Mousse Illuminee is resinous, mossy and bitter-green. Enter a dreamlike forest where the green lichen emanates a bright, silvery glow. Notes include: Treemoss, Frankincense, Green Cypress, Artemisia, Laurel Leaves, Cedar, White Floral Notes, White Musk.

rogueperfumery.com

Papillon Perfumery - Dryad

A sparkling galbanum emerald winds its way through the delicate flesh of bergamot: thus begin the wanderings of Dryad. Under jade roofs, sweet and spicy narcissus nestles against gilded jonquils. Shadows of apricot and citron transform bright green into a soft golden glow. Grounded with the...

ausliebezumduft.de

 

[mobyus]

This is from an IG ad.

Kalimantan Oud mixed with Luban stem cells to form a hardened blend.

 

[Shiningrobes]

Not sure this goes here. Today I drove past not one, but two orange groves just beginning to blossom. My allergies are wreaking havoc right now, but so worth it to roll the windows down and inhale like a madman. So intoxicating.

 

[YongShengChin]

oakmoss is such a trip. there are a relatively small number of super long skin scent materials and this is one of them. Sits right there along side labdanum, sandalwood, oud resin, vanillin and patchouli. These long lasting materials are precious and I wish I liked this one more in the context of perfume because I love it when it's all on its own. For whatever reason when I smell it in the dry down along with patchouli and labdanum, etc., it feels cheap to me. An association I have to get over.

I have been tempering with a base made up of oakmoss and labdanum. Oakmoss just doesn’t smell “right” to me. My idea was to create a Chypre fragrance. Like you mentioned, the dry down is far from what I pictured. I am drawing reference to Francois from TRNP and Maai from Bogue,

It always veer into something sour and stale.

 

[onedrop]

Can someone explain to me what Oakmoss is supposed to smell like? I've just received a bottle (my first) and it's a lot sweeter and flower like than I had anticipated. Hard to know how to use these substances when on their own often they're not that great. Bottle say's it's organic but it came from India so I have no way of proving that without buying another bottle from elsewhere.

oakmoss stands alone as a tremendous scent, fixative and in my opinion, a powerhouse behind truly memorable perfume blends of yesteryear. The problem was that is can be an allergen and was therefore reduced/removed from perfumer's pallettes during EU legislation. Having been substitued in classic/high street perfumery with synthetic 'oakmoss' is a disaster, in my opinion, as the artifical oakmoss is flat, dull and without any sparkle or depth. You many find it interesting to get hold of a small amount of oakmoss fragrance oil, which is clear and white and not green like the natural counterpart. It is a wonder that any artifical scents smell good when you have experienced the original, however EU rules are there and a well dosed perfume with fungal oakmoss, animal civet/castoerum may be difficult to get a cosmetic safety assessment verification, which is mandatory for putting professional perfume on the market in EU and UK. the absolute is darker and heavier and you may have either a co2 extract or Oakmoss absolute extended with a base such as almond/sunflower oil or di propylene glycol etc. It has never smelt floral to my nose and the absolute is heavy, inky and fabulous, however not all floral. Rather mossy, deep and pungent. The takeaway is to purchase from companies that list production methods and are known for being authentic (i'm not saying your isn't, I really don't know) Just some ideas. Take some hours to do a little online research on this ingredient, and should you have/get hold of a good one, wear gloves when blending and keep inclusion low in blends, as it fixes and anchors and does not need to be at the top of your mixture.

 

[Olfactory Nomad]

oakmoss essential oil stands alone as a tremendous scent, fixative and in my opinion, a powerhouse behind truly memorable perfume blends of yesteryear. The problem was that is can be an allergen and was therefore reduced/removed from perfumer's pallettes during EU legislation. I ruefully disposed of a bottle of this inky blue beauty as there is no reliable information (that I have seen) on it's production methods, which may, additionally produce harmful by products. I must admit I looked into this around 5-7 years ago and these days there is very little online about these production methods with potentially risky by products and instead a lot more about it's potential as an allergen. Having been substitued in classic/high street perfumery with synthetic 'oakmoss' is a disaster, in my opinion, as the artifical oakmoss is flat, dull and without any sparkle or depth. You many find it interesting to get hold of a small amount of oakmoss fragrance oil, which is clear and white and not blue like the natural counterpart. It is a wonder that any artifical scents smell good when you have experienced the original, however EU rules are there and a well dosed perfume with fungal oakmoss, animal civet/castoerum may be difficult to get a cosmetic safety assessment verification, which is mandatory for putting professional perfume on the market in EU and UK. Takeaway: put it on the top shelf and enjoy it from time to time from the bottle as it has a lot of depth and facets missing from modern perfume blends, all in one product! Use gloves when blending with it, in case you are someone who is allergised by it. There are some companies online specifically there production method of oakmoss, so should that be of concern, google search it for a few hours and get professional advice from a cosmetic chemist. I really miss having this oil. Enjoy.

I had to really think about my question that you had quoted as it was a few years ago that I posted it. That bottle has long since been binned as it was just awful, cheap rubbish.

 

[onedrop]

I had to really think about my question that you had quoted as it was a few years ago that I posted it. That bottle has long since been binned as it was just awful, cheap rubbish.

fair enough

 

[Shiningrobes]

Orange blossoms on the cool evening breeze,.a dot of Ghaliya Banu Hashim on the back of each hand, and taking small bites of really great chocolate and letting it melt slowly on my tongue. This is almost too much. Pure, sensory overload, bliss-out!

 

[Goodness Nose]

made some mead with orange blossom honey and lalvin d47 wine yeast! came out gorgeous. tastes halfway between a beer and a champagne. only a little sweetness left, and the aftertaste of honeycomb and orange florals. next batch will be with local honey and mead specific yeast for higher alcohol content. I plan on making 5 gallons to distill a batch of honey brandy. i'd also like to try making my own perfuming alcohol to really get that "from scratch" feel

 

[oudcast]

RBO Vetiver oil today to start with today. I get a dusty and non-orange carrot. It's actually really nice and even reminds me of the late drydowns of some ouds I've smelled. The clear-greenish hued carrot vibe is far from, but on the same spectrum as the "watery" smell I get from Maroke oud, for example. The more I smell this, the more impressed I am. I have never paid much attention to vetiver on its own but a lot of perfumes I like make use of a synthetic vetiver. I am curious how this would do being mixed with other things, but not enough to go down that rabbit hole.